Howard Dean is first.

What needs to be done in Iraq?  They need to make decisions, not us.    If you don't ask someone to leave your house, they might never go...

If we could get an lasting agreement between Israelis and Palestinians, half the terrorism in the world would go away

thanks for giving us Bill Clinton's words in Medford

Murtha, strongest opponent of war supports Hillary... I lost many friends in Viet Nam.  My best friend lives in a Vet home disabled....She cleaned up WR hospital ...a passionate issue for her...agent orange....gulf war disease.... huge deal....she a change maker, she won't forget when they play hail to the chief.

you ever go to pol rally and hear folks talk about car batteries [ cheers, laughs]  most of you experience health care as a cost problem...this is the only rich country in the world where everyoone is not covered....keept  the companies rich....30% of cost is paper work....buy into federal health insurance we have....no preexisting conditions....you all have to be covered...

She 's the best change-maker, ....I found who you for depends on what you think president ought to do. 

Robert kennedy's son thought she could change lives better.  Ask yourself this question.  How would you judge next pres when the term is done? 

Hillary said 1. better off. 2. young people have better future 3. world is coming together, not driven apart.

Yes to those 3 questions is yes to Hillary - thank you -END  TIME 1:20

Your welcome Phil, my pleasure, but my wife made the sacrifice and stopped cleaning so I could hear while typing

From Phil from the last thread:

"the price of feed has gotten so high that baby bull calves are practically being given away at the sale barn if anyone wants a pet, (warning they are very hard to house break)"

LOL

There were complaints about no questions/ answered - like Obama - mail-in voting in Oregon, ballots will go out in a month from now and most votes will be in before primary day....stay tuned

3.

FRED from Ashland OR
Sun, 03/30/08


What needs to be done in Iraq? They need to make decisions, not us. If you don't ask someone to leave your house, they might never go...
---------------

Good thing this blog exists. Years later everyone could look up back and check out what ones was said..., it would be amazingly entertaining to see own turned upside-down values system along with perverted logic.

If some were not invited but got into your house using force anyway what are the chances it’ll leave after you “ask” it to..., lol.

9. former

========

It was a kinda ass-backwards analogy

I would have to agree with Mike when he said that there a a lot of bigots in the northeast.  Sad, but true - and I speculate that they tend to be Regan Democrats.  Just an opinion.

BTW ::waving:: 2 cC and Annilow.  *r, I just like baseball and soccer in warm*er* days and think the g@d almighty dollar begins and extends the season to extremes (for my tastes - as Phil correctly pointed to) ...at least in northern states. 

OMG, the blog ( suc%$ the bag (

thread up at 9pm and I jump to 3rd at 10:22pm

Is there a problem Houston?

Come on HQ, if Milli Vanilli could to it, then you can to.  Milli Vanilli - Baby don´t forget my number

If some were not invited but got into your house using force anyway what are the chances it�ll leave after you �ask� it to..., lol.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

And what if someone knocked at your door and asked to buy your living room, and you said SURE, and they gave you some money and you gave them a deed.  And your wife yelled at you, and you said: Don't worry dear, I have no intention of honoring the deal.  And the government won't make me, either, wink wink. . . .   

Here's the clearest and simplest explanation I've yet seen of the grim reality that Hillary and her insiders -- and every politician -- must know.....

Here's the problem. Obama is ahead by 132 delegates according to RCP.

There are only 599 pledged delegates who have not been selected.

There are only 327 super delegates who have not committed left.

Presume that there are no further defections from the Hillary camp of SDs and that Obama only gets 45% of the remaining PDs. That would be another 268 PDs for Obama. Presuming no SD defections in the Obama camp. After the last ten contests Obama would have 1899 total delegates without any new super delegates.

Obama would only need 125 38% out of the 327 currently uncommitted super delegates to commit for him. Then Obama would have the nomination and control of the convention.

12. puddle

========

Clinton, today in Medford, OR

"If we could get an lasting agreement between Israelis and Palestinians, half the terrorism in the world would go away"

The interesting thing I found in "Blood and Religion" by Jonathan Cook, was that Yasser Arafat actually was supporting George W. Bush (the son) against Al Gore, because the Palestinians were treated with more respect and got better deals under President George H.W. Bush (the father) than they did under the Clinton administration. 

In the Arab culture the saying that  the "apple doesn't fall far from the tree" is much truer than in America, where children are much more likely to be independent and different from their parents. He thought George Junior would be better for his people than the vice president of Clinton.

cC, I apologize for the snark.

And yes, Palestinian statehood would be a good start.   

bye for now...be well. 

60 minutes -- Al looked and sounded great. He and Tipper give the Nobel money and matched it for his new ad campaign. How did the man get so wealthy? Oh yeah Google stock or Yahoo stock right?

Also on 60 minutes -- so very very ashamed of my country for what we did to that man and others in Gitmo - torturing them.

Surfing by Faux News - a piece on how the home foreclosures are causing such an uptick in animals being surrendered to shelters. If ANYONE is in the market for a pet, 2nd hand pets make wonderful pets - usually over the chewy stage and maybe housebroken. I've only had one purebred in my whole life - everyone else is a rescue -- they are just as loving and loyal and protective and wonderful as ones with pedigrees.

Inflation -- I paid FOUR PLUS DOLLARS FOR ONE HALF POUND of coffee (the half decaf kind) at Publix yesterday.

Judy for Dean can't believe Swiss franc and dollar are now the same value.

Happy Sunday night all.

45.*** cChalfonte***
Sun, 03/30/08

fred, it seems that you'd like to turn back the clock to 1948 and debate the creation of the State of Israel.  Yes, in the aftermath of the Holocaust Israel became a state.  That was 50 + years ago.  Israel exists and shall for the forseeable future...regardless of which party/person is in our White House.

=================

Sorry cC, that is when Zionism went took the wrong turn (early 1930s) 

Four score and seven years ago was how far Lincoln went back, the nation where all men are created equal*  was a lie that continued to be told...it was the footnote that needed to be addressed with a civil war.

I am not saying Israel needs a civil war, but their nation was also conceived in lies and its own "original sin," that has yet to be addressed.

Fred was transcibing Bill Clinton's remarks live from Medford Oregon talking about the ME as well as carrying over his (Fred's)conversation from the last thread and the campaign sounds like it has turned into the kind of issues and tone we deal with here all the time

I got a kick out of Clinton's words being confused with Fred's

quit while you're ahead Fred

flood watch here

OK PHil going for a walk

forgot to say IMO : ]

19. puddle
Sun, 03/30/08

Perhaps had Christians or Muslims been hunted down in Jewish countries, and turned over for "the final solution" that would not be true.  We didn't hunt them down, we just refused asylum to boatloads of them who had escaped, and sent them back, to their deaths.  As it stands, I think YES, HELL YES  the Jewish people need a state, one state in the whole of this earth, where they can be assured that will not happen again

======================

No good can come out of State that disenfranchises people of their ancestral home, through ethnic cleansing, without some kind of amends.  The State of  will not prevent another holocaust but only make one more likely.  It was not only refusal of some visas that prevent many of them from emigrating, but also the refusal of Germany to allow passage to emigrate.  Most of the world's Jews find where they live to be much less dangerous than Israel, for Jewish people.

How many people are we taking from Rwanda or Darfur? How many did we take from the 10,000,000 who starved to death in the Ukraine?

I don't need to be lectured on the horrors of the holocaust I've seen many films and read many books on it since my childhood, and my compassion is not lost.  But you cannot rationalize one injustice with another, no matter how great, and the revenge-politics is sadly misplaced.  Palestinians die today, while German nationals and Jews still make business deals and get along like there never was a holocaust.

The Jewish homeland in Palestine can just as well be a place where all people are given shelter and all people are welcome regardless of blood lines.  The Iron wall was a bad decision by the Zionist movement leaders in the 1930s to build up military and diplomatic force with major powers, to take Palestine by force.  It was called the Iron Wall. That is an historical documented fact.

In fact, Shlaim has said in his book that the right wing in Israel has even surpassed the objectives of Jabotinsky the father of the "Iron Wall" dogma, and still refuse to engage the Palestinians, even from a position of strength, as Jabotinsky said they should, once that strength was achieved.

Brute force was not the only way it had to be. 
It was the wrong thing to do, the wrong way to go, and the German holocaust, that followed ten years after, did not make it right.

Prayers, Phil.

puddle
Sun, 03/30/08

Reply to this
 

Instead of reading your one book one more time, save up your pennies, and visit the Holocaust Museum.  Stand on the steps of the Capitol on Holocaust Remembrance Day, and read the names of one Jewish village in Poland that died in Auschwitz.  Read the names, the ages, just one time. . . .  Every man, woman, baby, grandma. . . .

************************************************

Let's please not forget that before Hitler slaughtered the Jews, he had already found a "final solution" for the Gypsies and homosexuals.

When Diane and I visited her relatives in the Czech Republic and Slovakia in November '04, some of them pointed out Gypsies while we were traveling around and may as well have been using the "N" word :

Some choice comments :

"They're given public housing and they destroy it."

"They beg for money on the street, because they don't want to work."

These relatives who made these remarks were quietly respectful of my comparisons between their words and American bigots' words - probably since they had warmed up to us when we assured them that we were not part of the America which had re-elected GWB.

And, as always . . . . . . .

19. puddle

Instead of reading your one book one more time, save up your pennies, and visit the Holocaust Museum.  Stand on the steps of the Capitol on Holocaust Remembrance Day, and read the names of one Jewish village in Poland that died in Auschwitz.  Read the names, the ages, just one time. . . .  Every man, woman, baby, grandma. . . .

==========================

I do not read books to foment hatred. I read them to make sense of the senseless.  Killing Palestinian children will not bring those Jewish children back to life.  The Swedes took in 30,000 refugees from Iraq. 

Like the Iraqis - Most Palestinians to leave in 1948 were the wealthy and educated, the cultured and intelligent.  The people left, poor and ignorant, did not have the means to emmigrate. 

Most of the immigrants to Israel went after the war, and they were filled with rage from the holocaust.  It was the British (not the Palestinian people) who prevented immigration to Palestine during the war, was it not ?  And there was also a danger Hitler or the Axis would invade Palestine as well.

Bush didn't take any of the 2,000,000 Iraqi refugees.  There are enough human tragedies today that we can have compassion for, and you don't need to be Jewish to be compassionate (or to eat Levi's real Jewish Rye : )

or was it Levy's ?

Sorry cC, that is when Zionism went took the wrong turn (early 1930s) 

Four score and seven years ago was how far Lincoln went back, the nation where all men are created equal*  was a lie that continued to be told...it was the footnote that needed to be addressed with a civil war.

I am not saying Israel needs a civil war, but their nation was also======

Well....^that is a word salad^.  Utterly unresponsive to my comment yet you offer it as a response to my comment.  Israel was formed 50+ years ago.  The nation of Israel won't be in a "civil war" during your lifetime or your children's. You continue to argue against the creation of the state of Israel.  Done....50+ years ago.

Even if Arab nations were to declare war and attack Israel America would come to their defense...in a huge way, regardless of party/person in the White House.  Based on our commitment to them from the forming of the nation.

 You argue in favor of a civil war within Israel as though it were imminent or something...like Israelis are ready to go to war against each other any day now.  That is a zero probability occurrence.

We were able to tease out what you really want....the destruction of the State of Israel.   At least have the courage of your convictions and admit it and stop trying to say it in other ways....mostly with word salads.

 

FRED from Ashland OR
Mon, 03/31/08

Reply to this

******************************************************

It's Levy's - darn good Jewish rye bread - especially the seedless.

I do not read books to foment hatred. I read them to make sense of the senseless.==

My observation is that you take a fringe position and then work like the dickens to find fringey "sources" for fringe positions...similar to the vaccination issue.

27.

*** cChalfonte***
Mon, 03/31/08

...Utterly unresponsive to my comment yet you offer it as a response to my comment.  Israel was formed 50+ years ago.  The nation of Israel won't be in a "civil war" during your lifetime or your children's. You continue to argue against the creation of the state of Israel.  Done....50+ years ago.

===============
Our civil war and the reason for it, were a broad analogy of how ill-conceived both the U.S. and Israel were started from infancy.  It was not a comparison or call to war.

I never argued against the creation of the State of Israel.  I argue against the way it was created and the means of maintaining such a State by ethnic/religious purity and ethnic cleansing after forceably removing its indigenous peoples.

Saying that there is no need for a "Jewish State" does not mean I am against a homeland for Jews in Israel.

America was a homeland for all dispossessed, disenfranchise religious/ethnic people from its inception, but we did not make it a "Christian State" or a "Catholic State"

The idea that a piece of land will make Jews secure worldwide and insure against hatred and oppression is an obsolete concept in the nuclear age.  The existence of the United States is more of an insurance against that than the possession of the Holy Land.

There are Jewish people who would agree with me, but the brainwashing and politics is strong against it, not to mention the hate from the cycle of violence.
 

new thread.

33.David A. Stevenson
Mon, 03/31/08

It's Levy's - darn good Jewish rye bread - especially the seedless.
==========================

I used to love it, but since I became allergic to yeast, I eat Streit's Whole Wheat matzos (no kidding)

http://www.blogforamerica.com/view/24654

ekected last saturday from the 3rd district of va.

would be nice to have a preview space. how bout it danny?