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FISA Legislation: Another trench
Linked to groups: Democracy for Maryland
The Senate's Tuesday vote against closing debate on the Intelligence Committee version of FISA legislation was encouraging. But it's still possible that this awful legislation will pass the Senate with the worst provisions (telecom immunity and blanket warrants) essentially intact.
There is another fallback if that happens. The Senate version will have to be reconciled with the House version, and the latter is a much better bill that does not include retroactive immunity or blanket warrants. (Much closer in fact to the Senate Judiciary Committee version, that Harry Reid refused to send to the full Senate)
Speaker Pelosi has final say on which House members will sit on the Conference Committee. We need to urge her to appoint people who will not compromise on the rule of law or supporting the constitution. Her office just told me that a 15-day extension has passed the House, to give the Senate more time to hammer out a bill. So, along with contacting our Senators, we have some time to let our Reps and Speaker Pelosi know how we feel about this issue.
The Speaker's Washington office is (202) 225-4965; District office in SF is (415) 556-4862.
4.
donna in evanston
Wed, 01/30/08
Reply to this
"Darwinian Materialism?" Somebody has confused "Survival of the Fittest" with "Greed is Good." Hit the science books Tom.
========================
"Survival of the fittest [specialized]" was one of two laws laid down by Darwin. "Fittest" meaning "specialized" - well adapted to [fitting into]the environment, not necessarily "fit" in the healthy sense. This law applied to stable environments.
The second (less famous) survival principle of Darwin appied to changing environments, geologic revolutions, and is the direct antithesis to the first law.
That "survival of the unspecialized" means those organism LEAST specialized are more likely to survive and propagate is a changing environment than those more "fitted" (specialized.)
9:01 PST
Yes. The Deans are first.
Clinton Says She Can Control Her Husband.
Say what?
Wow, now, after all those years she finally learned to control her husband?
What a sad story, being in a marriage where you have to control your husband.
The feminists must be happy with Hillary now. She is in control.
Oh, how low has America sunk?
Then again, it's always about control, isn't it? Seems like dominance is the natural way to survive.
http://www.blogforamerica.com/view/23726...
last thred
New CA polls:
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/1...
9:05 PST
Holy mackeral: 18,000 in Denver (can't wait to hear from Pat)
and 13,000 in Phoenix. Hope this translates into votes.
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/1...
Election 2008: California Democratic Presidential PrimaryCalifornia: Clinton 43% Obama 40%Obama within 3 points of Clinton in CA. This is after FL primary and before John Edwards dropped out.
rae hart: look above a couple of posts. LOL. I know it's tough with a bouncing blog, hey?
My son used to play lacrosse at that DU lacrosse field shown at the Obama event.
Nite all.
9:14 PST
NY Times slamming Clinton on page one tomorrow.
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/1...
9:16 PST now I'm really gone!
Clinton Says She Can Control Her Husband.

But just to be fair, here's a real picture of her.......
Hey everybody. This blog is a rollercoaster ride. Some might get dizzy.~
This blog defies logic, rational planning, practical implementation, etc,. but it still lives.!
Weird
Election 2008: California Democratic Presidential PrimaryCalifornia: Clinton 43% Obama 40%Obama within 3 points of Clinton in CA.
I'm actually starting to feel sorry for her.
SLAP!
Thanks....I needed that!
(Still not an ounce of sympathy for Edwards though.)
hello, anyone home? hugs and prayers to Tanner, puddle and family - my love and hope to you all.
Phil, hope you get a break in the weather soon - I sure can't complain about mine when I see what you've been going thru this winter.
I'm sorry to see JE drop out so soon - he is a good man and his wife is such a wonderful complement to him! I can't imagine right now just what his future will be, but I don't see him 'going away' for long. I do hope they have many years together yet.
I do believe Barack Obama is a good man and would make a great President. I love the Lakoff piece - he understands what so many are feeling yet the pundits miss or scorn. for instance...
First, triangulation: moving to the right -- adopting right-wing positions -- to get more votes. Bill Clinton did it and Hillary believes in it. It is what she means by "bipartisanship." Obama means the opposite by "bipartisanship." To Obama, it is a recognition that central progressive moral principles are fundamental American principles. For him, bipartisanship means finding people who call themselves "conservatives" or "independents," but who share those central American values with progressives. Obama thus doesn't have to surrender or dilute his principles for the sake of "bipartisanship."
I went to see Barack Obama speak tonight in Phoenix. I would estimate the place held 3,000 people and it was 90% full.
Caroline Kennedy introduced Janet Napolitano who introduced Obama. He spoke for about an hour. It was mostly stump speech stuff. The only new line that sticks out in my mind is about being "Right on day one." He also joked about being a distant cousin of *&^% +#@!. He said when you think about who you might be related you....you hope that it's somebody cool.
The crowd was loudest when he spoke of ending the war in Iraq.
Obama mentioned wind, solar, and hydro-electric power. He did not flaunt his support for liquid coal.
He did say, however, that if you make less than $50,000 a year, you won't be paying any taxes. This is the first time I've ever heard him say that-- Doesn't mean he hasn't said it before, though. I am not everywhere at all times. (I'm not really a superhero. It's just a screename).
20.
Jo,
"To Obama, it is a recognition that central progressive moral principles are fundamental American principles. For him, bipartisanship means finding people who call themselves "conservatives" or "independents," but who share those central American values with progressives. Obama thus doesn't have to surrender or dilute his principles for the sake of "bipartisanship."
__
I wish Obama would put it so concisely. That's very well said.
Here's local coverage of Barack Obama in Phoenix.
http://www.azcentral.com/community/phoenix/articles/0130phx-obama0201.html
The only person who needs to sit down and be quiet more than BC is Ralph Nader, who may run for President....again.
Do not give this man money!
Ralph, Al Gore has proven that you can get your point across without running for President.
Give your ego a rest.
This article states there were between 10,000 and 13,000 people in Phoenix.
http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0130APobama0130-ON.html
A post with some good explanations of MI and FL delegates and whether they will count. Bottom line it appears they will only count if no one needs them to win.
1. Me too. A chuckle in the morning is good.
Good morning, everybody 4:42 AM EST
Just read over part of the Biden/Mukasey discussion
But the truth of the matter is, I just never heard the issue of torture discussed in -- or what constitutes torture, which is defined by shocking the conscience -- in terms of the relative benefit that might be gained from engaging a technique. I find that--none of the Aristotelian logic I was trained by even got me there. I don't understand that premise.
Me thinks Biden just hasn't been paying attention. That the moral value of an act is defined by the intent of the actor, rather than the effect, is the central tenet of the conservative ideology. It's what the dictator or autocrat has to believe in order to be able to subjugate other human beings.
Progressive Avenger
Thu, 01/31/08
Reply to this
The only person who needs to sit down and be quiet more than BC is Ralph Nader, who may run for President....again.
Do not give this man money!
Ralph, Al Gore has proven that you can get your point across without running for President.
Give your ego a rest.
+++
Progressive -
Kind of reminds me of Richie Cunningham calling a grandstander "Ralph Mouth".
Great comment of yours about the man who would be president -- let's see, round three ? As John Stossler says "Give me a break" Ralph 'Mouth" Nader.
OK, so perhaps the blog is not jumpy this morning. Since our grandson has come to stay with us, I'm on a new regimen, making sure he catches the school bus on time and has everything he needs for school. We had to explain to him that we aren't entirely motivated by an eleemosynary impulse in keeping him, but are keen to find out how well our taxes are being used by the school. (Seems like I have been misspelling this word rather regularly and now there are several entries on Google)
Mea culpa. It's eleemosynary.
7:06 AM EST
Kennedy's Endorsement of Obama Had Family Roots
By Mary Ann Akers And Paul KaneThursday, January 31, 2008; Page A19
There's more to Sen. Edward M. Kennedy's endorsement of Sen. Barack Obama than meets the eye. Apparently, part of the reason the liberal lion from Massachusetts embraced Obama (Ill.) was a perceived slight at the Kennedy family's civil rights legacy by the other Democratic front-runner, Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-N.Y.).
A source close to the family says Kennedy was privately irate at Clinton for her praise of President Lyndon Baines Johnson's role in the passage of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. Kennedy felt Clinton's comments were an implicit snub of his brother, President John F. Kennedy, who proposed the landmark civil rights initiative.
Sources say Kennedy was upset about the tenor of events late in the campaign in New Hampshire.
On Jan. 7, in Dover, a Clinton supporter introduced the former first lady by saying: "Some people compare one of the other candidates to John F. Kennedy. But he was assassinated. And Lyndon Baines Johnson was the one who actually" signed the civil rights bill into law.
The Kennedy insider says Sen. Kennedy was deeply offended that Clinton remained silent and "sat passively by" rather than correcting the portrayal of his slain brother's civil rights record.
...
Kennedy also was upset that Clinton said on the same day: "Dr. King's dream began to be realized when President Johnson passed the Civil Rights Act. It took a president to get it done."
The senator also was said to be furious with former president Bill Clinton for his "Southern strategy"-themed comments on the campaign trail. The senator didn't hide his disdain for the nasty tone of the campaign during his endorsement speech at American University on Monday.
...
for those in the Minneapolis area:
http://www.kare11.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=495683
Planning to see Obama Saturday? Get your free ticket now...his appearance in Minneapolis on Saturday.Obama will speak at a rally at Target Center. Doors open at 1:30 p.m. ...The event is free and open to the public, but the campaign says tickets are required.
They can be obtained from the Obama campaign Web site, from one of his seven campaign offices across the state, or at Coffman Union at the University of Minnesota in Minneapolis.
Obama has campaign offices in St. Paul, Minneapolis, Rochester, Mankato, Duluth, St. Cloud and Brainerd.
7:!8 AM EST
30.
Monica Smith
Thu, 01/31/08
OK I'm glad you know how to spell it. So what the h* does it mean lol?
bbl-school day
7:21 AM EST
http://demconwatch.blogspot.com/2008/01/superdelegate-list.html
...
1/30/08 - Removed John Edwards' Superdelegates after he dropped out today.
- Added Washington Senator Patty Murray for Clinton
- Added Florida Senator Bill Nelson for Clinton
- Added California Rep. Anna Eshoo and DNC Bill Orton (UT) for Obama
...
7:28 AM EST
New Jersey:
http://www.app.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080131/NEWS/801310582
By Jonathan Tamari • GANNETT STATE BUREAU • January 31, 2008
As the race for the Democratic presidential nomination turned into a two-person contest, New Jersey political heavyweights who had endorsed John Edwards realigned Wednesday with the two remaining candidates, Hillary Rodham Clinton and Barack Obama.
Senate President Richard J. Codey, D-Essex, one of the state's most popular political figures, is expected to endorse Obama. He has a news conference scheduled for 1 p.m. today.
Senate Majority Leader Stephen Sweeney, D-Gloucester, and Sen. Joseph Vitale, D-Middlesex, along with Edwards' state director, Michael Beson, switched their allegiances to Clinton.
...
Montclair State University professor of political science and law Brigid Harrison doubted endorsements would have much impact on the race here.
"Most voters go to the polls and follow their gut instinct," Harrison said.
But Harrison said Codey's expected support for Obama enhances the Illinois senator's campaign, especially with much of New Jersey's Democratic establishment backing Clinton.
"Had Codey decided to endorse Clinton, it would have made the race a little bit more of a runaway in the voters' minds," Harrison said.
Clinton had a 12-point advantage in New Jersey, according to a Monmouth University/Gannett New Jersey poll released Jan. 15.
Hopefully this will help Obama in CA.
LARGEST INDEPENDENT VOTER ORGANIZATION IN CALIFORNIA ENDORSES OBAMA
LOS ANGELES – IndependentVoice.org, California’s largest organization of independent voters, has endorsed Senator Barack Obama for President in the open Democratic primary on February 5. The endorsement of the 200,000 member organization could impact significantly on the outcome of the primary, with close to 20% of Democratic primary voters expected to be decline-to-state independents.
7:46 AM EST
MailbagIssue date: 1/31/08 Section: OpinionsObama voters not so na'veDaniel Greenberg's letter ("Obama counting on uninformed youth" 1/29) focused on one central fallacy, that Obama's voters are as he states, "na've and rather uninformed." Though this may be his opinion, it is disproved by simple facts. The truth is that in the primaries the most educated among the voters sided with Obama. ...It is a natural step that these higher education levels would lead to a better knowledge of the issues. As such, a better knowledge of the issues would allow an individual to choose a candidate that will better solve the problems currently facing America and the world. Maybe a vote for Obama isn't so "na've" after all.
7:49 AM EST
in Colorado:
http://www.greeleytrib.com/article/20080131/NEWS/557109839/-1/rss02
Gary Hart to stump for Obama in Greeley
Staff Reports
January 31, 2008
Former Colorado Sen. Gary Hart will stump for Sen. Barack Obama in Greeley and Fort Collins today. Hart also is Obama's national campaign cochairman.
Hart will meet with supporters and undecided voters to encourage them to participate in Tuesday's caucus. He also will visit locations in Estes Park and Denver to reach out to potential caucus-goers across the state.
At 11 a.m., Hart will visit the El Rodeo Mexican Food restaurant, 1029 9th St., in Greeley.
...
7:52 AM EST
http://www.panarmenian.net/news/eng/?nid=24702
ANCA endorses Barack Obama
31.01.2008 15:44 GMT+04:00/PanARMENIAN.Net/ The Armenian National Committee of America (ANCA) endorsed Barack Obama as the Democratic candidate best positioned to bring fundamental change to how the United States addresses issues of special concern to Armenian American voters.
...
"To Obama, it is a recognition that central progressive moral principles are fundamental American principles. For him, bipartisanship means finding people who call themselves "conservatives" or "independents," but who share those central American values with progressives. Obama thus doesn't have to surrender or dilute his principles for the sake of "bipartisanship."<<<<
__
I wish Obama would put it so concisely. That's very well said. <<<<
Lakoff is a linguist. When did he get into the mindreading business? Lol. Seriously, there is little difference in the words between Bill Clinton 1992 and Barack Obama now. We have no way of gleaning Obama's intent which is what Lakoff is attempting to do. Course, I came to believe that he was in over his head about 2 years ago. Overreaches.
I'm not saying that Obama's intent is other than the quote from Lakoff but we don't really know. He hasn't enough of a record yet. I'll support him in the general without a doubt but just had to raise that.
To be clear, George Lakoff is a hack......(or became one, actually).
Now, an endorsement from Gary Hart? THAT is big in my eyes.
Off to work. Have a great day, all.
Good morning, BFA.
***********
Omigosh, I woke up to see that Tom B had actually given me a kudo. A little one, but a kudo, to be sure.
LOL, Tom ♥
I do not believe in being negative about the outcome in Nov, because if I am, I might as well just give up and apply for Swiss citizenship right now. No, I am not going to give up. Not yet. America is my country and I will not peersonally do anything that will aid or abet the Rethugs, the contemporary version of which I consider literally to be the forces of evil, as much as Hitler's Nazis were.
If 'Cain is really the best that they've got, then they are in sorry shape. Let us not only remember that but keep saying it and let us remember that WE here are not Tne Enemy.
We KNOW who The Enemy is and it has never been more clear.
As for Nader, well, he will do what he has always done, which is exactly what he wants to do. He was a good man once, even a great one, but after his muddling putz with Gore in 2000, he became the antithesis of what he once was. Anyone who gives him money to fund a campaign is indirectly helping the Rethugs. It is as simple as that. Some may not agree with that assessment. Tough.
But I AM still very sorry to see Edwards gone. We needed to hear his voice awhile longer.
Thanks for the candles for Tanner, puddle. Any new news of the good variety?
***************
Here's an interesting op-ed in today's WaPo.
==============
A Good Fight
By Peter Beinart
Thursday, January 31, 2008; A21
The tone of the Obama-Clinton race has pundits worried. "The concern is this bitter campaign could end up hurting whoever the nominee is," CNN's Jack Cafferty warned last week. The contest, Peggy Noonan wrote in the Wall Street Journal, is "tearing the party apart." On MSNBC, Newsweek's Howard Fineman dubbed it a "civil war."
Huh? For starters, the contest between Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama isn't all that nasty. To be sure, it has had its low moments: Clinton surrogates raising Obama's past drug use, for instance. But by recent historical standards, it's nothing out of the ordinary. In 1992, Jerry Brown accused Bill Clinton of funneling business to Hillary's law firm. In 2000, supporters of President Bush accused rivals of spreading rumors that he had used cocaine. That same year, Al Gore insinuated that Bill Bradley's health-care plan was racist, and Bradley bashed Gore for holding a fundraiser at a Buddhist temple. For better or worse, this is what American presidential politics is like.
What's more, bitter primary contests don't necessarily hurt candidates in the general election. In a 1998 study, the University of New Mexico's Lonna Rae Atkeson found that when you control for other factors, divisive presidential primaries have a "marginal or even nonexistent effect in understanding general election outcomes." To be sure, when an incumbent president faces a tough primary challenge, it's usually a sign that he's in trouble. Think of Gerald Ford in 1976, Jimmy Carter in 1980 or George H.W. Bush in 1992. But it's important to distinguish cause from effect. Ford, Carter and Bush were all politically weak, which is why they ultimately lost. Their primary challengers didn't cause that weakness; the weakness caused those challengers to run.
But when there's no incumbent, a tough primary challenge doesn't tell you anything about a candidate's chances in November. Yes, nasty contests can leave the losers' supporters embittered and less likely to turn out in the general election. (They can also expose vulnerabilities that are later exploited by the other side.) But heated primary battles also mobilize voters, some of whom stay mobilized even if their party nominates someone else. Many of the people who got involved in Democratic politics because of Howard Dean in 2004, for instance, worked to elect John Kerry in the fall.
[...]
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con...
The NYT tries to see where Edwards' support will end up.
==============
January 30, 2008, 6:31 pm
Plotting the Post-Edwards Strategy
By Ron Klain
John Edwards’s departure from the race Wednesday — after poor showings in Nevada and South Carolina — was no surprise. In the often cold-hearted world of politics, the time for tribute and farewell is brief, and the question quickly arises: How can the two remaining candidates benefit from Mr. Edwards’s exit? And what should they do to maximize that benefit?
Much of the initial coverage on Wednesday noted that Mr. Edwards’s supporters were largely white, working-class and economically downscale — closer demographically to Hillary Clinton voters than to Barack Obama voters. But this fact, which suggests an advantage for Senator Clinton, may have another side: if Mr. Edwards’s supporters are similar to Senator Clinton’s, but didn’t vote for her, does that suggest that they have some hardened reluctance toward her?
The fact is that Mr. Edwards’s electoral support, like all of the other assets his campaign amassed, is up for grabs, and where it will wind up is not preordained. With just six days before the largest primary day in United States history, what do Senators Obama and Clinton have to do to maximize their potential gains from this opening?
[...]
http://campaignstops.blogs.nytimes.com/2...
JudyforDean
Thu, 01/31/08
...
As for Nader, well, he will do what he has always done, which is exactly what he wants to do. He was a good man once, even a great one, but after his muddling putz with Gore in 2000, he became the antithesis of what he once was.
...
+++
Indeed.
Do you remember, what with all the things that were thrown at Howard that he had to respond to in the 2004 election, that Ralph (aka Malph, trans "Mouth") Nader did his perienial song and dance that there were no differences between the repubs and the dems and that Howard was all part of that sameness ?
IMO what a waste of time for a serious candidate like Howard was to have to even take time out to debate for Nader (and Nader afterwards thought he won the debate, jeez what a ego that guy has).
Tell us something that we didn't know. Anything that the Rethugs touch literally turns to ashes and dust, after a lot of chaos and human misery.
I am selfishly happy that my nephew has returned from his second and last tour in Afghanistan. My granddaughter's aunt is still in Iraq, however, and my prayers are with her ... and all others serving putz's misguided delusions of grandeur around the globe.
===============
Afghanistan risks becoming 'failed state', reports warn
Roxanne Escobales, Mark Tran and agencies
Thursday January 31, 2008
Guardian Unlimited
Two independent reports from Afghanistan's former Nato commander warned today that the country risks becoming a "failed state" due to the continuing violence and economic instability.
A third report from Oxfam, in the form of an open letter to the prime minister, Gordon Brown, warns the situation in Afghanistan could lead to a humanitarian disaster.
The warnings coincided with separate bomb attacks in Helmand province and Kandahar, which killed a total of seven people.
A suicide bomber blew himself up beside people who were praying inside a mosque in the provincial capital of Lashkar Gah, said the province's police chief, Mohammad Hussein Andiwal.
Helmand's deputy governor, Pir Mohammad, was killed in the blast, which killed five other people and wounded 18 others, seven seriously. The mosque's prayer leader was also killed, he said.
Haji Ikramullah, a witness who was on his way to pray at the mosque when the blast shook the ground, said he saw dead bodies inside and wounded people crying in pain.
The blast happened hours after another suicide bomber in a car targeted an Afghan army bus in Kabul, killing one civilian and wounding four other people, officials said.
[...]
http://www.guardian.co.uk/print/0,,33231...
This has been affecting my internet connections to my workplace. It is difficult even to get in and even when I finally do get in, I get frozen with regularity. Ah well, there's always the telephone.
I don't like having such vulernability because there are those who would love to destroy our access to the internet and global communications altogether. Most are in the party of 'Cain, which is just one of the many reasons while I will fight any Rethug as hard as I can.
==================
Faulty cable blacks out internet for millions
· India and Egypt among countries hit by outage
· Damage to undersea connection to blame
Tens of millions of internet users across the Middle East and Asia have been left without access to the web after a technical fault cut millions of connections.
The outage, which is being blamed on a fault in a single undersea cable, has severely restricted internet access in countries including India, Egypt and Saudi Arabia and left huge numbers of people struggling to get online.
Observers say that the digital blackout first struck yesterday morning, with the Egypt's communications ministry suggesting it was caused by a cut in a major internet pipeline linking it to Europe.
The line in question runs under the Mediterranean, from Palermo in Italy to Alexandria in Egypt. It is not clear what caused the break. The cable is one of only a handful of connections, and part of the world's longest undersea cable, 24,500 miles long, running from Germany, through the Middle East and India before terminating in Australia and Japan.
[...]
http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/200...
I don't know whether any here have been following this rather tawdry murder in Italy. It's been a small sensation in the UK because the victim was from the UK and one of the prime suspects is from the US.
It has nothing to do with politics, it's just a very sad commentary on squandered educational opportunities and sociopathic personalities.
=================
Police find mystery DNA on Kercher bra
Press Association
Thursday January 31, 2008
Guardian Unlimited
Police investigating the murder of the British exchange student Meredith Kercher in Italy have found mystery traces of DNA on her bra, it was revealed today.
The three traces - believed to be from two males and a female - do not match up with any of the three suspects currently being held over the 21-year-old's death.
The discovery will prompt speculation that somebody else could have been involved in the killing, although one of the suspect's lawyers said police were not making that assumption.
Kercher's American housemate, 20-year-old Amanda Knox, her Italian boyfriend Raffaele Sollecito, 23, and 21-year-old Ivorian Rudy Guede, are all in prison near Perugia.
They are accused of murdering Kercher, a Leeds University student from Coulsdon, Surrey, on November 1 last year. She was found at her home in the city with her throat cut, and police said there was evidence of a violent sexual encounter.
The new discovery was made by forensics officers analysing one of Kercher's bras, found at the house, in Via della Pergola. They had already identified DNA belonging to Guede and Sollecito on the garment.
[...]
http://www.guardian.co.uk/print/0,,33232...
8:57 AM EST
healthcare penalties:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/bloomberg/20080131/pl_bloomberg/an09shaoto94_1
Penalties for Uninsured Supported by Clinton, Romney, Not Obama
Aliza Marcus and Avram Goldstein Thu Jan 31, 12:08 AM ET
Jan. 31 (Bloomberg) -- Democrat Hillary Clinton is closer to Republican Mitt Romney than she is to her party rival in the presidential campaign, Barack Obama, when it comes to providing health insurance to all Americans.
Just as car owners are required by state laws to have auto insurance, Americans should be required to purchase medical policies or apply for government-subsidized plans, Clinton says. Health coverage mandates by the U.S. won't be needed if government assures that insurance is affordable, Obama responds.
...
UnitedHealth, WellPoint
Insurers, who helped defeat the national health-care plan offered by Clinton in the early 1990s, are more aligned with her view than Obama's this time.
Executives at UnitedHealth Group Inc. of Minnetonka, Minnesota, the largest U.S. health insurer, and WellPoint Inc., of Indianapolis, the second largest, say Democratic proposals that require them to accept anyone who applies won't work economically unless everyone is in the coverage pool.
``For this to work, you need the healthy to subsidize it,'' said Wayne DeVeydt, WellPoint's chief financial officer, in an interview.
``We'll continue to prosper'' under such a plan, said UnitedHealth spokesman Keith Oestreich.
Clinton hasn't said how big a penalty the uninsured would face. Analysts say it would have to be substantial.
``You need a minimum $3,000 penalty on income taxes or a healthy 20-year-old isn't going to have health insurance,'' said Christine Arnold, a health-care analyst with Morgan Stanley in New York, in a telephone interview.
...
Obama's Position
Obama, 46, says he would make coverage mandatory only for children because adults can decide for themselves.
``The problem is not that folks are trying to avoid getting health care,'' Obama said. ``The problem is they can't afford it.
...
The make-believe warrior pledges support to Hollow Man 'Cain.
===================
January 31, 2008
Arnie to pledge support for John McCain
John McCain will today receive the backing of California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger, cementing his position as frontrunner for the Republican nomination before next week's wave of elections in delegate-rich states.
The former action hero film star will appear at a press conference with Mr McCain in Los Angeles and deliver another body blow to the hopes of Mitt Romney, who was reported last night to have balked at spending millions of dollars on TV advertising in the 21 states - including California - which vote on Tuesday.
Mr Schwarzenegger's is the second big name prize for Mr McCain in less than 24 hours following his victory in Tuesday's Florida primary. Last night, ahead of a televised debate at the Reagan presidential library in Simi Valley, he was endorsed by Rudy Giuliani.
[...]
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/wo...
Time to get cracking here now ... have good ones.
mccain was shit out of g/w what a joke, so was the debate like watching two old dogs fighting over an old bitch, cnn sucks!! anderson cooper what a jerk
The “people” running this country are warmongering mass murdering terrorists, PERIOD. A rigged election will not change this fact. Removal and prosecution of this regime will NEVER happen. This country was founded on mass murder and it will continue in the tradition of mass murder.
The only hope is that WE THE PEOPLE will rise up and FORCE them out with nationwide civil disobedience and other extreme tactics. Even that may be too little, too late.
9:18 AM EST
http://www.contactmusic.com/news.nsf/article/gore%20documentary%20sets%20record%20in%20japan_1057824
AL GORE - GORE DOCUMENTARY SETS RECORD IN JAPANThe Al Gore
global-warming documentary An Inconvenient Truth has set a new box-office record for a single theater in Japan, exhibitor Toho Cinema said Monday. In its first week at the Roppongi Hills multiplex near Tokyo, some 60,000 patrons paid an estimated 90 million yen ($850,000) to see the film.
...
Judy
I don't know if the hundreds of thousands of deaths and the massive dislocation of millions ranks with Stalin's tens of millions or Hitler's genocide, but the use of lethal force for some vision that includes private gain is immoral enough to reach the "evil" category. (for that matter so does the utter disregard of the people of the Gulf Coast) Since the world has a system of justice in place to handle "evil" leaders in the Hague maybe we just need to patiently wait for the wheels to grind.
to me Bush mirrors the original little fearlesswarleader Napolean without any of the redeeming civic values What Louisiana Purchase will America have to sell to pay for his folly?
the good news is that when we lose our national sovereignty because of debt then the international system of justice might give bushco their day in court
Lucifer was released when they blew that hole into the PENTA-gon. 911 inside job! fools if you think not!
cC wrote "We have no way of gleaning Obama's intent which is what Lakoff is attempting to do."
You mean Lakoff is not the Amazing Kreskin? Though this comes as a great shock, I still believe your statement should more accurately indicate that while you feel incapable of gleaning Obama's intent, others may be more cognizant of what Obama has been up to on the campaign trail, and feel it possible to make out Obama's intent from outward signs, whether or not they are able to penetrate the workings of his inner consciousness.
The key, of course, is whether Obama's words and actions can be taken at face value or, stated otherwise, whether he is sincere (for a politician) or an ordinary con artist. We know for example, that he has a history of reaching across the aisle to accomodate members of the opposing party to enact laws that he supported as a liberal lawmaker. We also know that he favorably regards the power to influence policy in this country that Reagan had because of Reagan's effectiveness at coalition building.
We know this is the case despite of Obama's selfless work as a community organizer and his antipathy towards Reagan's misguided policy agenda. In fact, we know that Obama has borrowed liberally from the operating procedure of Howard Dean, another candidate with a progressive agenda who worked with Republicans in his home state and earned the ire of third party legislators on the left in order to push through socially conscious and fiscally responsible legislation. Without the ability to read Dean's mind, I nevertheless feel less helpless than you do in discerning his intent. I'm assuming, however, as with Obama, that Dean wasn't attempting to pull something over on us. To that extent, naturally, you're absolutely correct. How would we know?
DANIEL ROONEY
Thu, 01/31/08
...
cnn sucks!! anderson cooper what a jerk
+++
Well, I didn't catch the repub debate last night but just saw clips of it in the news afterwards. I didn't like how Copper cut off Ron Paul from talking (IMO Paul's at least got more sense in his head than McCain, Romney and Huckabee combined, especially on the subject of not getting involved in dumb wars and finding a way out once foolishly enough to get in).
New thread.
9:35 AM EST
typo - I didn't like how Copper cut off Ron Paul from
s/b - I didn't like how Cooper cut off Ron Paul from
(also, btw, speaking of dumb wars, yesterday was the 50th anniversary of the Tet Offensive: http://www.ludingtondailynews.com/news.php?story_id=38881 )
us all, the bad guys win, come out of the barn for some air phil,
The problem with Clinton is that he's a parvenu. And, one suspects, he's got an inferiority complex which leaves him unsatisfied by any achievement. His appetite for self-agrandizement is insatiable. Just like for Bush Two.
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By mary vb on Jan 30, 2008 11:45 PM ESTThe Deans are so first!!!
ABC News: Clinton Says She Can Control Her Husband.
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the headline make me chuckle.