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How should progressives talk about health care security in America?
Linked to groups: Health Care for America Organizers
This Rockridge Institute study is about the we and us debate in comparison to the me and mine debate. Their ad is very interesting.
(video) Rockridge Institute healthcare ad Don't Think of a Sick Child: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bg44c9ZvA0E
Don't Think of a Sick Child: The Logic of the Health Care Debate
In launching this campaign, the Rockridge Institute is contributing to progressives as they consider and focus their health care message. We have written a thoughtful white paper, as well as talking points, prototype television advertisements, blog posts, op-eds, and other material designed to bring some consistency and honest framing to the cause of health care security. To the many groups and individuals engaged in this cause, it is our hope we will be of some help to your heroic efforts.
more found here: http://www.rockridgeinstitute.org/health
The Logic of the Health Care Debate
by George Lakoff, Eric Haas, Glenn W. Smith, Scott Parkinson
Introduction
"Most health care reports advocate a policy, describe it, and argue for it. We take a different approach. In this paper, we describe the logic of the overall debate over the U.S. health care system -the assumptions, the arguments, who makes them, and why. We do come out of this process with recommendations, but not of the usual sort.
"This analysis presents something new and important: a distinction among three modes of thought - progressive, conservative, and neoliberal. What's new here is a deeper understanding of neoliberal thought, as it affects the discourse on health care. Briefly, it accepts the progressive ethic of care, insisting on maximizing coverage. Meanwhile, neoliberal thought accepts a conservative version of market principles that guarantees profits to insurance and drug companies. Often, this is done in the name of political pragmatism, as a way to mute expected conservative opposition. This creates an inherent tension between the moral mission of government to provide for the protection - in this case the health security - of all of its people and the profit-maximizing insurance marketplace, which works only by denying care.
"The neoliberal mode of thought is at the center of the health care debate. It can also be found in issues across the board."... full report: http://www.rockridgeinstitute.org/research/rockridge/the-logic-of-the-health-care-debate
Just talked with Thankful. She's on her way out of Chicago, and heading towards Massachusetts. Traveling mercies, please.
LOL, Puddle, Howard is still the wootiest on firsties.
From the previous thread
Susan Rowe
Sat, 11/10/07
1:05 pm
Clean Money Clean Campaigns: http://www.publicampaign.org/
Watch the video: http://www.caclean.org/materials/watch.p...
BLOOD MONEY
How are campaign contributions affecting health care policy? Go behind the scenes and learn what really happens in Sacramento. Hear about the links between money and policy. Find out what you can do to effect necessary policy changes. http://eventful.com/events/pasadena/outd...
Byron Williams, a pastor in Oakland a board member of the California Clean Money Campaign writes up his experience moderating a panel discussion on the relationship between California health care policy, and the campaign donation clout of HMOs. full article: http://www.publicampaign.org/blog/2007/1...
Here is a You Tube Video making the case for an Office of the National Nurse.
We could use your support in recommending this diary on Kos too:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/11/10/145312/68
I hope these both turn out as links. Thanks for your support!!!
KID'S HEALTH CARE: Rep. Pete Stark Blasts GOP on SCHIP, Iraq
hi Susan
For our
What are Progressive Values? Documentary Project
http://ProgressiveSpirit.com
I'd like to interview people about the underlying values for the different issues.
So, what are the underlying values related to Heath Care?
I interviewed Patricia Player about this at a local event here in El Cerrito. She works with the OneCare Now Campaign .
Pat sees Security as the underlying Value of Health Care.. From her interview, I saw the relationship between security and caring.. If you feel secure, you are more likely to open up and care for others.. If you are fearful of not having health care, you will close up and not be able to care for others as much. So the security of decent health care will lead to a more caring society.
Progressive Values? Patricia Player - Security
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmcHgSDMGY0
OneCareNow Campaign
http://www.onecarenow.org
Some other values I see:
Democracy - With single payer, we have more democratic control over health care, versus undemocratic authoritarian corporations deciding who lives and who dies.
Efficiency - Resources will be used more efficiency with Single payer. The corporate insurance company waste will be eliminated. I think it was 30 percent overhead versues 7 percent with single payer.
Fairness - It's not fair that tens of millions of people cannot afford health care.
What values do others see at stake here?
Overpopulation or Childfree Town Project
http://www.city-data.com/forum/politics-...
http://www.blogforamerica.com/view/22907...
Hi.
I am writing because I am interested in overpopulation activists in small towns. I am hoping that if overpopulation activists concentrate forces like the Libertarians of the Free Town Project, http://freetownproject.com/ we can build a majority that can replace public school, playground, ballfield, and childcare funding with contraception and abortion funding and end up saving a great deal of money especially since Social Security and Medicare funding are mostly federal and can be imported.
Housing unit size could also be limited to crowd large families but regular zoning is a big problem because it makes it expensive for overpopulation activists to move in and build a majority.
Anyway, what do you think? Can such a majority be built in your hometown. NYC is the only municipality I know of that funds abortions and it is too overcrowded and thus difficult and expensive to move to or build a majority in. And NYC's abortion funding is still only a tiny fraction of their education funding.
http://freetownproject.com/
http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=2140...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cascadia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_E...
http://christianexodus.org
http://www.abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=3...
Three groups likely to be allied in this municipal cause are gays, especially conservative gays like Log Cabin Republicans, retirees, who would be hypocrites because they usually have grown children and grandchildren but these grandchildren often live in different towns and would be unaffected by local education cuts, and Libertarians who are ideologically committed to small government.
Free abortion on demand is part of most single payer health plans, but I want it from select municipal governments where it is most politically realistic and in isolation. The childfree will not go along with healthcare that begins with children, we must begin with contraception and abortion instead.
What progressives are moving towards is a more egalitarian society, where every individual is treated as a person with dignity.
Imagine a world of people who are emotionally, physically and mentally healthy. All war and crime and anger would cease.
So... providing health care reduces crime. Happy healthy people do not lash out at others, either with guns or with words. JMO
Couldn't something like this be part of the dem platform? We have a prez who is mentally and emotionally severely impaired and look where we are.
Over-population and large families....isn't that a bit of a self-defeating contradiction?
Methinks there are some Ditmores somewhere who yearn to have been childfree. LOL
12. Clearly, there are no guarantees. Bush Two had the best of everything and look how badly he turned out.
Healthy people are less likely to infect the rest of us.
12.
he's just manifesting the conservative values. "mentally and emotionally severely empared" my fit better for conservativism and it's values.
Seems to me there's a lot of energy whasted by putting the blame on Bush and not where it belongs, which is on failed conservative values.
Now is the time for the Gore netroots to really get into the draft Gore movement.
DGNH (Draft Gore New Hampshire) is putting together a NH primary campaign budget and, of course, we need contributions.
The ActBlue link is below:
https://secure.actblue.com/contribute/en...
Politics ain't cheap. We will not be spending a fraction of what all the other campaigns are spending. But money is needed with the Write In campaign.
It is the early "seed" money that will help get us up and operating so that Gore has a fighting chance in the New Hampshire primary in January.
Time for
a COOL
change,
Gore!
Al Gore: Health Care is a Right
http://current.com/items/84987281_health...
Gore Vidal, and the condition of America
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/oct...
Martin Lee Anderson's mother said the guards and lawyers laughed during the trial. How tragic.
16.
Alan Ditmore
Sat, 11/10/07
4:37 pm
This guy is a sproll (troll and spammer) and I'm not overly fond of kids.
Well, my break is over, thank you for the company. Hubby's cutting wall tile and I have to finish trim tile in the bathroom before heading back to the back bedrooms.
It was funny. I did both back bedrooms in the middle....waiting for the cut tile...and I laughed, I felt like I was stairing on 2001 Odysseys' (from Saturday Night Fever) dance floor. I stood on it and posed the infamous J V stand. LOL....
ciao!
Sat, 11/10/07
9:29 am
Reply to this
A lot of those crosses belong to Democratic cowards.
<
I don't stomach that kinda talk - like folk like Huron don't stomach the deaths during this Republican administration. It doesn't help and causes fissure in the left of right wing faction. In fact I can see how moderates would slam the door on the "peaceniks" and work against the left.
So keep it up at your hope's peril, or change your damn tune, Huron.
What ever you want to do is fine with me.
Bush personifies, glorifies and encourages the failed republican values. He's the CinC of the compassionless society.
Monica, I respectfully disagree that Bush had everything. He had the monied family, but look at his parents. He was emotionally stunted, spiritually uneducated and mentally prolly born the way he is. Didn't his parents go golfing right after his sister died and he was told not to cry? I thought that was in his biography, but maybe not.
But to turn out to be a war criminal does not speak well of the parents. He was spoiled, coddled and allowed to avoid service. This is not to blame all parents for everything, but I do think in his case, the parents played a huge roll in messing him up and letting him continue. He needs an intervention but they let him bring down the country. Nice family, the Bushes.
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/111007A.shtml
Steve Mufson reports in Saturday's Washington Post that "Oil consumers are paying $4 billion to $5 billion more for crude oil every day than they did just five years ago, pumping more than $2 trillion into the coffers of oil companies and oil-producing nations this year alone."
SANTIAGO, Chile — The king of Spain told Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez to "shut up" Saturday during a heated exchange at a summit of leaders from Latin America, Spain and Portugal.
Chavez, who called President Bush the "devil" on the floor of the United Nations last year, triggered the exchange by repeatedly referring to former Spanish Prime Minister Jose Maria Aznar as a "fascist."
Aznar, a conservative who was an ally of Bush as prime minister, "is a fascist," Chavez said in a speech at the Ibero-American summit in Santiago, Chile. "Fascists are not human. A snake is more human."
Spain's current socialist prime minister, Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero, responded during his own allotted time by urging Chavez to be more diplomatic in his words and respect other leaders despite political differences.
"Former President Aznar was democratically elected by the Spanish people and was a legitimate representative of the Spanish people," he said, eliciting applause from the gathered heads of state.
Chavez repeatedly tried to interrupt, but his microphone was off.
Spanish King Juan Carlos, seated next to Zapatero, angrily turned to Chavez and said, "Why don't you shut up?"
The Venezuelan leader did not immediately respond, but later used time ceded to him by his close ally Nicaraguan President Daniel Ortega to answer Zapatero's speech.
"I do not offend by telling the truth," he said. "The Venezuelan government reserves the right to respond to any aggression, anywhere, in any space and in any manner."
>
Is that a threat to Spain? Wow, Chavez may be off-his-rocker.
On the statement of Fasist, Chavez may have a point.
In the end, Zapatero had gave good advice to Chavez saying, "Former President Aznar was democratically elected by the Spanish people and was a legitimate representative of the Spanish people,"
Congressman Joe Sestak Delivers Democratic Radio Address
http://www.democrats.org/a/2007/11/congressman_joe.php
Fascism at its finest. BTW, has anyone heard Edwards, Obama or Clinton say they would repeal the MCA or the so-called Patriot Act? Åre they even being asked these questions in IA? Do you know, Phil? I'd like names and emails of these committee members mentioned below.
FOCUS | Antiwar Veterans Groups Barred From Parade
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/111007Y.shtml
Kelly Puente of the Long Beach Press-Telegram reports that a Veterans Day parade committee rejected the applications of two veterans groups that oppose the war in Iraq from participating in Saturday's parade honoring US soldiers because committee organizers don't want "groups of a political nature, advocating the troops' withdrawal from Iraq."
VETERAN"S DAY
___________________________
Congressman Joe Sestak from Pennsylvania delivered this week's Democratic Radio Address.
"Good morning, I am Congressman Joe Sestak from Pennsylvania. I am a former three-star Admiral who was fortunate to have served this nation in the fury of war and the challenges of peace for 31 years in our Navy. I am also the son of a Navy Captain who fought in World War II.
"Today, I would like to talk to you about all of those who have worn the 'cloth of this nation' and the covenant that our country has to care for our veterans who have ensured that America would always remain worthy of its ideals.
"What has made our veterans' profession so special is that it has the 'dignity of danger' in a common cause where there is a higher purpose to life than oneself. There is a painting that hangs in the Pentagon that depicts a serviceman with his family in church. Clearly, he is praying before a deployment and long separation. Below the painting is a quote from Isaiah in which God asks, 'Whom shall I send; who will go for us?' And Isaiah replies, 'Here am I; send me.' Every veteran has said, 'Here am I, America, send me.'
"And in doing so, they have become part of a special brotherhood, where serving together forms a bond that stands the eternal test of time, with a memory that also finds the 'grandest sepulcher of all - a home in the hearts of brave men and women.' But our solemn obligation to our veterans for the service they gave goes well beyond this memory.
"Today, Americans are fighting two wars with casualty rates far higher and tours of duty far longer than the planners of those conflicts ever estimated, and with our returning veterans facing increased challenges from health care and educational needs to job opportunities. At the same time, our World War II, Korean, Vietnam and first Gulf War veterans are faced with medical challenges and expenses that they could not have anticipated, and a new study out this week found that one in four of our nation's homeless is a veteran.
"Tomorrow is Veterans Day, a special opportunity not only to reflect on the sacrifices of those who have served us nobly, but to ensure that our veterans are honored by action as well as remembrance for the freedoms they and their families have earned for us all.
"Today, our troops serving overseas in two wars - and their families - represent less than one 1 percent of our nation's 300 million citizens as they carry the burden of the current conflicts. It is therefore not only critical that Congress is working for a new direction in Iraq, but also that we recognize that the people in uniform today look to us to see how we relate to our veterans, which they will soon become. That is why the Democrats in Congress are working together with the President to see that veterans - aging and young - and their families receive the benefits they need and deserve.
"The New Direction Congress has supported landmark legislation to increase the Veterans budget by $6.7 billion dollars - the largest single increase in the 77-year history of the Veterans Administration. And there is a $4.4 billion dollar increase in Veterans medical care, including $600 million additional dollars for new initiatives for mental health and Post Traumatic Stress Disorder.
"Each war is different: our World War II veterans were in combat on average for six months - in the most horrific of battles - with some dwell time in between for physical and mental rest. Today, our soldiers and Marines in Iraq go 'outside the wire' into combat every day for 15 straight months, with many returning for several tours. That is why 17 percent of service members returning from the war have experienced Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, and over one third of returning veterans suffer from a mental health problem like depression or anxiety - and why Congress acted.
"Democrats have also expanded resources for traumatic brain injury and research and rehabilitation, while extending from two to four years, following discharge from the military, the eligibility period to receive medical care by the Veterans Administration. And we added thousands of VA case workers to reduce unconscionable delays in getting veterans the care they need.
"Our service members are a national treasure that stir our hearts and spur our conscious by their actions. And as veterans, this 'band of brothers' remains a national treasure, having put their lives and their faith in America. In return, we must continue to keep faith with them. That is why the Democratic Congress is keeping our covenant to care for our veterans and their families.
"I am Congressman Joe Sestak of Pennsylvania's 7th Congressional District. Thank you very much for listening."
24. Paine:
don't stomach that kinda talk - like folk like Huron don't stomach the deaths during this Republican administration. It doesn't help and causes fissure in the left of right wing faction. In fact I can see how moderates would slam the door on the "peaceniks" and work against the left.
So keep it up at your hope's peril, or change your damn tune, Huron
I ain't about to change my damn tune, Paine.
Denial is not a River in Egypt. Congressional Democrats have blood on their hands since January of this year. They have the power to bring the troops home and they haven't used it, the snivelling cowards!
ANOTHER REASON TO SUPPORT DENNIS
http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_tim_rile_071110_stop_the_lies_and_th.htm
The Bush Administration neo-cons would like for us to be on the brink of starting yet another war justified by the same kind of lies that they used to start the war in Iraq. The pieces are in place for a false flag terror attack, another Pearl Harbor event, martial law, and power consolidation at the expense of the Constitutional rule of law, billions of dollars, and countless dead, drowned, and nuked into oblivion. And as horrified spectators might watch a slow moving train wreck, we watch the news wires nervously hoping that a manufactured provocation (details yet to be revealed as some incredibly sick Christmas or New Years surprise) won't actually occur.
Don't listen to the cynics who say we can do nothing. Don't demotivate yourself with moaning and complaints about the unresponsive or complicit Democratic leadership [sic]. Exert political pressure. You might be surprised to learn that many representatives do listen, and they may even want to act in the way that you will suggest, but as politicians many of them fear getting ahead of conventional wisdom. Yeah, ok that doesn't exactly scream out "fearless leadership", but it is a political reality and they must see the groundswell to feel as if they can safely take action. They do respond to real pressure and popular support. You just need to direct your efforts so that they see and hear you. You are the key to change. Let's be the change that we wish to see. We can motivate them to take action.
with House Judiciary Committee members and their staff to quickly address House Resolution 799 (formerly numbered HR 333) - Impeaching Richard B. Cheney, Vice President of the United States, for high crimes and misdemeanors.Dick Cheney must be impeached and removed from office. He is the prime instigator, deceiver (links to source transcripts to numerous to list - please refer to the articles of impeachment), and the original war monger. Much could be accomplished by dragging his office through impeachment proceedings and occupying them with politically defensive measures. Putting the Veep and his minions on the defensive can potentially derail any false flag terror event and stop them from publicly pushing for war with Iran. Cheney won't be able to soften up the press with more lies, spun to manufacture consent for more war.
I'd like to hear Sam's reaction to the barring of the vets against the war.
Imn2Paine
Sat, 11/10/07
6:17 pm
Huron
I also added "What ever you want to do is fine with me."
That doesn't temper or excuse your earlier statementsI'd also like to know why Cheney was in Portland while I was gone, involving himself with terrorist stuff. Is Portland targeted for the false flag alert? God knows we've had enuf cells here.
Despite Paine's crass outburst, I'll say again, the Democrats share the blame and the shame for a lot of these crosses.
Even Pelosi is criticizing Congress and she' definitely a large part of the problem.
Which convention precedes the other? If Guiliani wins and Hillary too, the dems better knock her outta the race at the convention, since a potential match up has them neck and neck and we don't need another one of those to lose.
I met a man the other day who is a Gore/Feingold man and said he'd vote for Hillary to make sure another repug doesn't get in. It's that kind of thinking that gave us the loser, Kerry,and will give us another loser.
Gore/?
Hard to keep up hope for Gore but I'm trying.
On thread topic, Susan, Kucinich is advocating universal, single-payer coverage; The DLC/Establishment candidates want to leave big insurance and big pharma in charge of the henhouse (thanks to their big contributions).
A year after Democrats took control of both houses of Congress, due in large part to the public's frustration with the occupation of Iraq, Democratic Speaker Nancy Pelosi unveiled a new plan Thursday that ties additional war funding to the withdrawal of US troops from the region.
HO HUM THEY'LL FOLD AGAIN!
Because of their misplaced loyalty to Israel and AIPAC, the Democrats are allowing (nay, encouraging) Cheney/Bush to attack Iran, which doesn't threaten us (or Israel for that matter).
Thay'll have plenty more to answer for if they don't stop the madness.
In a November 9 New York Times article, Iowa waitress Anita Esterday criticized the media's response to her recent comment to National Public Radio that "nobody got left a tip" when Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-NY) and her campaign staff ate at the restaurant where she works. According to the article, Esterday told a Times reporter: "You people are really nuts. ... There's kids dying in the war, the price of oil right now -- there's better things in this world to be thinking about than who served Hillary Clinton at Maid-Rite and who got a tip and who didn't get a tip."
~Media Matters
_______________________
A "terrible" performance
The dominant political story of the past week and a half has been Hillary Clinton's performance in the October 30 Democratic presidential debate. During and immediately after the debate, the general consensus was certainly not that Clinton had fallen on her face. As Eric Boehlert explained this week:
[...]
"Breathtakingly misleading"
If the media's rush to declare Clinton's performance a disaster sounds familiar, it's because there are striking similarities to the last debate performance to be so universally and harshly condemned by the media: Al Gore's during the 2000 general election.
[...]
>
And, what of Swiftboating and the treatment of that crazy one-time frontrunner Gov Howard Dean M.D. ?
Senator Clinton won the debate.
The same media had W the victor in all of his debate because he didn't fall flat on his face.
MSNBC's Matthews cited wife of his high school band mate to explain "why Hillary likes to clap"
http://mediamatters.org/items/200711100001
Imagine how much better off we'd all be if Anita Esterday had a television show on MSNBC, and Chris Matthews worked in a diner in Iowa.
~Media Matters
Seashell......
Howard said this week....that he, unlike some others, thinks that this election could be very close. Unfortunately, it was his parting statement on the Schultz show Fri. with Norman Goldman. There was no time to ask further thoughts.
Iowa JJDinner on c-span tonight at 8 PM. I hope Howard will be there. Pelosi will speak, but I can turn the sound down and find something else to do.
Twink: 'Do You Hear the Frog'
click
Ralph Nader was live on C-span's Book TV at the Miami Book Fair today. He has written a book about his childhood and growing up.
But beyond that, his very long talk badmouthed the Democrats throughout, not that this is anything new for him. He still blames Florida voters for Gore losing Florida, not himself. Never a word about the Republicans and how destructive they have been the last 7 years.
Same old Nader, nothing new except the new book which is rather arrogant and self-glorifying.
MSNBC's Matthews cited wife of his high school band mate to explain "why Hillary likes to clap"
Issues, records, and proposals are SO boring. Instead, let's talk about spouses, distant relatives, clapping, who was around in the 60s, and "electability."
46.
Pelosi will speak, but I can turn the sound down and find something else to do.
LOL audrey.
I usually advise MUTE as it only involves one quick push on the remote.
(Photo: Annie Wells / The Los Angeles Times) >SPILLED SEED
Who would Democrats blame if they didn't have Strawman Nader?
54.
Right on Sitka. Matthews, also on the same Book TV, wouldn't shut his yap about how the great things about Hillary. His book must be as boring as he was today.
va tech beats florida state. good game.
woot.
going tomorrow to see bruce springstein in d.c . love it.
dancing in the dark .
58.
good game for you:)) FSU does not have its usual excellent team this year. VT - so,so. Neither team will make the national picture this year.
Squares
Slang. A person who is regarded as dull, rigidly conventional, and out of touch with current trends.
are fighting the 60's all over again. At least the CMedia (<that's a cool way to write it) frame it that'a ways.
Matthews...His book
>
One can't conspire with the CMedia personalities, so the personalities write a book and the corrupt guarrantee a royalty.
How should progressives talk about health care security in America?
>
Thanks, Susan
...but where is the input from HQ?
HQ is absent and WE do not like it one frickin' bit! Am I wrong?
For my Greener buddies:
FORK TONGUE works for US
____________________
"The two parties have combined against us to nullify our power by a ‘gentleman's agreement' of non-recognition, no matter how we vote ... May God write us down as asses if ever again we are found putting our trust in either the Republican or the Democratic Parties." -- W.E.B. DuBois (1922)
African American Political Pundit says: The Bush Administration speaks with fork tongue.
39. you keep posting that picture, so i'll tell you something. that's less than 10 miles from where i live. i know the person who started it and maintains it. she's a democrat. a democrat thought enough to do this in the face of a red community. people tried to destroy the crosses. tried to take legal action to stop her. but you know what, a democrat fought to keep it going and there it stays. a democrat.
Phil was correct (again...He lives there and is OUR connection to Iowa politics)
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071110/ap_on_el_pr/democrats_courting_iowa
Six Democrats court activists
DES MOINES, Iowa - The race for the Democratic presidential nomination moved into overdrive Saturday, as candidates scrambled to outdo each other to win over the Iowa activists who will leadoff the contest on Jan. 3.
[...]
Advocates for various causes were holding news conferences seeking a slice of the heavy media attention. Anti-war activists were joined in a protest march by backers of former Sen. Mike Gravel and Ohio Rep. Dennis Kucinich, who were not invited to the dinner because they don't have active campaign operations in the state.
Never give up hope for good.
Al Gore:
Restore Rule of Law
Jan 16, 2006
At the same time, the Executive Branch has claimed a previously unrecognized authority to mistreat prisoners in its custody in ways that plainly constitute torture in a pattern that has now been documented in U.S. facilities located in several countries around the world.
Over 100 of these captives have reportedly died while being tortured by Executive Branch interrogators and many more have been broken and humiliated. In the notorious Abu Ghraib prison, investigators who documented the pattern of torture estimated that more than 90 percent of the victims were innocent of any charges.
This shameful exercise of power overturns a set of principles that our nation has observed since General Washington first enunciated them during our Revolutionary War and has been observed by every president since then – until now. These practices violate the Geneva Conventions and the International Convention Against Torture, not to mention our own laws against torture.
The President has also claimed that he has the authority to kidnap individuals in foreign countries and deliver them for imprisonment and interrogation on our behalf by autocratic regimes in nations that are infamous for the cruelty of their techniques for torture.
...
If the President has the inherent authority to eavesdrop, imprison citizens on his own declaration, kidnap and torture, then what can’t he do?
...
For example, after appearing to support legislation sponsored by John McCain to stop the continuation of torture, the President declared in the act of signing the bill that he reserved the right not to comply with it.
http://www.libertycoalition.net/govt-sur...
video
http://www.acslaw.org/node/2096
"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
With out
", one Nation under God,"
it then
Sounds ALL INCLUSIVE to me.
LOL...just had a friend send me some virtual energy to continue this tiling and thought I'd share.
bbl
I Am Woman"
http://www.rhapsody.com/album/70srockhit...
(Helen Reddy and Ray Burton)
I am woman, hear me roar
In numbers too big to ignore
And I know too much to go back an' pretend 'Cause I've heard it all before
And I've been down there on the floor No one's ever gonna keep me down again
Oh yes, I am wise
But it's wisdom born of pain
Yes, I've paid the price
But look how much I gained
If I have to
I can do anything
I am strong (strong)
I am invincible (invincible)
I am woman
You can bend but never break me
'Cause it only serves to make me
More determined to achieve my final goal And I come back even stronger Not a
novice any longer 'Cause you've deepened the conviction in my soul
Oh, yes, I am wise
But it's wisdom born of pain
Yes, I've paid the price
But look how much I gained
If I have to
I can face anything
I am strong (strong)
I am invincible (invincible)
I am woman
I am woman watch me grow
See me standing toe to toe
As I spread my lovin' arms across the land But I'm still an embryo With a
long, long way to go Until I make my brother understand
Oh, yes, I am wise
But it's wisdom born of pain
Yes, I've paid the price
But look how much I gained
If I have to
I can face anything
I am strong (strong)
I am invincible (invincible)
I am woman
Oh, I am woman
I am invincible
I am strong
I am woman
I am invincible
I am strong
I am woman
OK, mprov. Just fine. Had a problem with karma and my inablility to induce a gift to Denise, but I'm over that...
Sen. Mike Gravel and Ohio Rep. Dennis Kucinich, who were not invited to the dinner because they don't have active campaign operations in the state.
Uh-huh. Hopefully it will outrage some people to show up for them who otherwise wouldn't.
There's a new thread. This one loks fun, tho. WFMU stuff is great, but I've grown kinda fond of archive.org with the old, old blues.
Well, Paine, that doesn't stop us others who's Karma is whacked, but we still come. LOL
Happy your Ying is back with Yang and your Chi is on to bring you back. :)
"I pledge allegiance to the Flag
The day I pledge allegiance to a flag is the day I go back to grade school.
Who said, he "wants ''to be the candidate for guys with Confederate flags in their pickup trucks.''
Hey seashell - were you talking to me? : )
Anti-war vets kept out of the Veteran's Day Parade....
My first thought was of the older World War II Vets that might be in the parade and how proud we all are of them - and they're proud and the Korean War vets, Viet Nam, Afghanistan and Iraq. A day to celebrate and remember those who served so well - and those who died. And that's probably what we'd like it to be. A proud day. Unfortunately, our present Vets are in a technically illegal war, horribly planned and not winning; they want this war stopped. They have the right to be in the parade. THEY are veterans, and served proudly, too. Being against a war is NOT POLITICAL - unless, it's a purely political war.... I understand what the 'parade planner's are thinking... that it should be proud, flags flying, salutes and ribbons...wonderful America. LIke the good old days. But this is 'America' and ALL Veterans should be honored and be able to speak the truth - even if it hurts. I guess we ask - who would it offend? Not 70% of the people on the sidewalks...and I would imagine their World War II fellow veterans and many of the others, would be in total agreement with them. My Father is a WWII Vet, purple heart. He gets all upset about this terrible wrong Iraq war and what our 'boys' are paying for it. Dad's attitude: "I want BUSH on the first un-armored humvee into Falluja!".
Caetano Veloso Nine Out Of Ten Transa PolyGram 1:52:33 (Real) http://wfmu.org/playlists/shows/24987
OH those wiley, sneaky Democrats. All these wonderful things they’re doing and they don’t even have time to BRAG about it. And of course, our MEDIA won’t be saying anything good about any Democrat. Or have you noticed… On Democrat orders – BUSH has had to change his strategy:WE STOPPED THE DYING.The failed SURGE has stopped: Threats about progress and being ‘watched’ and our troops dying in huge numbers. Bush had to pull them off the streets and let the air force come in and bomb whole buildings instead – killing civilians. REDEPLOYMENT: NO troops in Southern Iraq – NO troops in Western Iraq – NO troops in Northern Iraq – Hey, I’d call that REDEPLOYMENT. Out of harm’s way. A lot of them can come home now…WE saved their lives.HOLDING IRAQ WAR FUNDS: Yep –the Democrats are going to piece meal it out . They want to see progress…and they want our troops HOMEINVESTIGATIONIES: WAR fraud – mass quantities.IMPEACHMENT: Brought up and put down on the books for the rest of time. And of course, Fox news just said that the Democrats, in doing this piece meal pay out – will be STARVING THE TROOPS. No – but I wouldn’t put it past Bush – as a political move. Sick, huh. WHO lied us into the war? Who will veto any attempt to get us out of the war? WHO is going along with the crazed President? Whose candidates are still all pushing for the war! Icky sticky, frightened, brainwashed Republicans.
On the surface, the idea that people have to pay something for their health care sounds reasonable. The problem is how much. Take the example of a $15 copay. Well, $15, that's nothing, some people would say. But if you are an older worker, suddenly that $15 multiplies when one is buying a couple of prescriptions and needs a few office visits per month. No one talks about mental health care, but where there is a weekly appointment, that also adds up. With a high corporate salary, these copays may not be very much, for a state government employee at a lower level, such as a secretary or a librarian at a state college, copays become a problem. So even people with "good" health insurance plans are going without medical care because of the copays. This gets even worse with insurance plans that have copays as percents. Copays should not be percents. 20% of the cost of a mammogram is a lot of money.
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By puddle on Nov 8, 2007 12:59 PM ESTHoward's the very most firstliest!
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