Thank you, Tom.

Take care,

---Susan

Thanks, Tom, and good luck in your new endeavor. Come back and blog once in a while; we know you'll stay connected!

 Congrats to Al Gore for the Nobel Peace Prize. Now decide to run and make our day.

thanks tom, now off for a while.

Thank you Tom,

I will miss your emails and your leadership, it has been wonderful working with you!

Lynn in Cincinnati

Thank you Tom.  Your are correct, one could not ask for a better set of mentors.

Thank you Tom and good luck. 

The DFA 2.0, under your watch,  has really turned out to be a real asset to the progressive movement in America and a counterweight against misinformation spread by all those in government, the media, and groups and bodies that don't share the concept of trying to reach the truth.

there's an online Congratulations Vice President Gore for winning the Nobel peace Prize signing card (hey, it's put up by the DSCC by I signed it anyways):

http://www.democratsenators.org/o/4/t/90/petition.jsp?petition_KEY=79&BOOL18=1

Good luck to you Tom! Our paths have crossed several times over the years, from San Jose to Manchester. Best of efforts to you on your new journey.

Who is Barrington Irving?

The youngest person to fly solo around the world.  Sure got a lot of publicity, didn't he?

A household name. 

Here's my comment I posted:

Dear Mr. Vice President Al Gore -

I'm so estactic today about you winning the Nobel Peace Prize, a prize shared along with the UN's Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change government body.

Speaking of climate, it's been raining practically everyday this week here in southeastern Massaschusetts, after nearly two months of no rain.

First I enjoyed the rain but then it started to get me tired of seeing it everyday.

Well the sun broke out this morning just a few hours after the announcement of your win.

Poetic justice I would think and a good sign.

Have a bright and sunny day and future.

Sincerely and Respectfully,

And while we're thanking people, thank you DFA HQ and Locals for holding our Democratic Reps accountable, and endorsing Mark Pera and Donna Edwards in their respective primaries.

Liberal Base Proves Trying to Democrats

“There is a tendency in American politics for the people who feel most passionately about an issue, particularly ones that focus on a single issue, to be unrealistic in what a democratic political system can deliver,” Mr. Frank said, “and that can be self-defeating.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/12/washin...

Best to you, Tom Hughes.   DFA will miss you.

Well, the trial of the guards and the nurse who beat or watched as a kid died....has gone to the jury.  

The nurse said it was not her job to tell the guards what to do, so she stood by and let 7 big guards beat a kid.  And he died.

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1571

Title of a new Daily Kos diary:

"BREAKING: SCOTUS Declares Bush the Nobel Peace Prize Winner"

I wouldn't be surprised...

 Thanks for everything Tom.  DFA and us blog bumz will miss you.

New England says "buh-bye" to Collins & Sununu, too.

Pfffffffft. 

..and a hello to the "other Tom" (Allen).

A great set of mentors indeed, Tom. So sad that you are leaving. You have done so much for democracy and DFA. I wish you happiness and luck on your future.

Be well.

12. Like it or not, the base of the Democratic party is liberal. The Dems blow them off at their peril.

Al Gore making first appearance since the Nobel Peace Prize announcement in less than 15 minutes.

What does it mean to be a liberal?  To believe in liberty, rather than obedience.

Conservatives have to be committed to obedience because they believe that "all men are created evil" and it's the state's responsibility to make them good. 

Linda what channels?? Network or cable?

Hi mainefem!!

xoxoox

A sure sign of a vital organization--people come and go and the organization continues.

Farewell, Tom and thanks for everything. 

mainefem wrote "and a hello to the 'other Tom' (Allen)."

Tom Allen is a moderate hack.  Don't you read the hoary DLC membership lists that get sported around here?

The Corporate media can keep pushing their Corporate candidates, but if they all don't wake up and face realities, instead of just playing a game, we (progressives and democrats) will find ourselves in a bad place next year.

See, they see the numbers. They know the excitement isn't there. They keep playing the DLC/Neo Con handbook that has failed the Progressives and Democrats and aided the Republicans. The same game plan that we'll accept anyone and they see it isn't working. But when will THEY CHANGE COURSE?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNF_P281Uu4

Well, I saw the announcement on the newspaper's site, the Abq Journal and I put on MSNBC and they say...countdown to his appearance. So I suspect many will cover, but definitely MSNBC.

21

Oh this oughta be fun.

Thanks Linda - yes MSNBC is the place to be!!

CENSORED SATIRE?

http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/diarypage.php?did=4605

I guess all America is wondering, as I am, what happened to Jon Stewart and Stephen Colbert. They used to be iconoclastic. They used to express public outrage. They used to be funny. Viacom, jewel of the embedded mass media and employer of these two performers, must have said something, because they have both quit saying anything.

Most of Colbert's material is aimed at Colbert, and Stewart mainly picks on people who are already being kicked around by the media. Iran receives a generous share of derision, but Israel is never mentioned on either show. The two brainy comedians practice a postmodern brand of satire that afflicts the afflicted and comforts the comfortable. Their audience will soon lose interest, and they will be justly shuttled into trite cinema, Hollywood's refuge for prostituted satirists.

Thanks, Tom, for all you've done.
One might wonder whether you were going to work for an old mentor, if he were planning a campaign or anything........
You know we're all giddy with the possibilities today.
Please keep in touch!
Jane

CNN Headline news reporting that Gore is to meet with the press around 1:45 ET and they'll be showing it. Time to refresh the coffee!

this is what it is to be a patriot. no matter what the cost.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwc5YSAc-7g

going to get some ice tea and watch al gore. then off to do pix.

got company coming on tuesday and trying to let the place look presentable.

http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/linkframe.php?linkid=43684

Democrats bow to Wall Street, saving tax break for billionaires

(WHAT ELSE IS NEW?)

The Democratic Party leadership in the US Senate has effectively killed proposals put forward earlier this year to close a tax loophole that allows billionaire managers of hedge and private equity funds to enjoy tax rates on their income that are far lower than those imposed on average American workers.

The main legislative proposal put forward in the House of Representatives would have compelled the super-rich fund managers to report their earnings as regular income and pay the 35 percent rate. It has been estimated that the measure would have created at least $6 billion in additional federal revenues.

According to the Washington Post, however, the Senate’s Democratic leadership has already assured the billionaire and multi-millionaire financiers that would be affected by the measure that they have nothing to worry about.

THANKS, A-HOLES!

29.  Sigh. . .

Huron John
Fri, 10/12/07
1:23 pm
___________________________________________________________________________

Theres an old saying, "money talks and bullshit walks"...................

SPINELESS

How does a majority party that, had they resisted, would have been both politically and morally in the right respond? By replying, of course, "How high?" Because, the Times quotes some professor, "Many members continue to fear that if they don't support whatever the president asks for, they'll be perceived as soft on terrorism."

Get Gore live

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/video/2005/04/12/VI2005041201139.html 

2 minute warning, Tipper is with him, no questions will be taken. Will only make a statement.

1:45 Eastern?  What time is that here?  CNN is reporting that it'll cover the speech by Al, but I have to leave for my doctor's app't.

How can this happen?  Once in a lifetime and waiting for months and I have a silly doctor's app't.

Please, come on now, Al. 

On now

For our Great Mother.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4YhZIRqA...

Tipper looks like she's been crying all day.

..."how best to use this honor"?.....I have a hint....


Run, Al, Run!!!

Sorry, no comments.  LOL

to the other Tom (Bearse), I guess what you were saying about NH and I was willing to let it go for the time being (because MI's and FL's move had a greater chance, IMO, of causing other states like CA and IL to do the same, than NH's move -- due to NH being part of the 4 states stated as not being able to hold a primary or caucus before Feb 5).  I guess also, the decision by DNC to diversify the early states by putting Nevada in front of NH caused me to think that possibly NH had some reason to move in front of NV because it still was in Jan and still was behind IA.

Well, I just saw this news piece about the possibility that NH might jump to early Dec -- what ???!!!

I though MI's dem chairman Mark Brewer was really stepping out of line but this NH's Secretary of State Bill Gardner IMO looks like a real piece of work.

My God, what is this, all these dem state chairman and/or secretaries of state giving no respect to the DNC and to Howard Dean in particular and to the American public as a whole ?

They wouldn't have pulled this stunt on Terri McAulliffe IMO.  Why are they treating Dean like he's Rodney Dangerfield ?  Didn't Howard get enough of that disrespect when he was running for President amongst certain dem circles ?  I thought the reason that so many dem chairs voted for Dean in early 2005 to become the next DNC Chairman was because they like his independence and his tenacity and his 50-state strategy ?

I just don't understand all this whirlwind of shuffling, musical chairs [the real chair you seat on, not the state chair peoplpe] on the caucus/primary schedule this presidential cycle.  The whole scene reminds me of abunch of sweathogs all reaching their hands in the air ''Oooh !  Oohh !" pick me, pick me.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/10/11/AR2007101102109.html

By Joel AchenbachWashington Post Staff Writer
Friday, October 12, 2007; Page A01

CONCORD, N.H. -- The New Hampshire primary, crowded by other wannabe primaries and caucuses, may be shifted from January to an unprecedented date in early December. It all depends on the calculations of one man.

"I have a lot of discretion," said Bill Gardner, the 16-term secretary of state of New Hampshire, who is invested with what amounts to dictatorial power to set the date under state law. "We are prepared, if it needs to be early December, it can be early December."

...

I' ve been crying my eyes out...bouncing between CNN and MSNBC, because MSNBC was ticking me off.

CNN actually had some great coverage of Al Gore. Incredible comments by Bill Clinton and Jimmy Carter.

Al Gore deserves this and so much more. I suspect that is why Tipper looked as she did, tears of joy. But you saw her throat even choke up and almost start crying until she gave a laugh. That must be the trick I should give a trying.


{{{{Al Gore}}}

bbl

some great photos from lastnight to share of one of Tom Hughes' mentors.

Is Al's segment up on youtube yet?  i went to the link above and the only thing on was Bozobrain and I can't listen to him much less watch him.

OK, I fibbed.  I'll be gone in a sec.

Did yo know the petition site gathered 15 thousand signatures OVER NIGHT?

And now it's up about 5 thousand just from earlier today.

ok...bbl 

gee, cnn had to cut away so they could tell us that anna niclole's drs home are being searched. along with all the horrible pix of her.

cm are whores.

That jury found all the guards and the nurse not guilty..    I knew they would.  It is Florida after all.

This is an earlier post about the all white jury and the implications.

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1574

OK, it's already topped and jumped over 20 thousand from lastnight.

Mz Little, I checked you tube and google video and nothing yet.  But 

I know it takes a while to upload...oh, maybe we should check out

Al Gore's tv network....www.currenttv.com

Really need to go, Monday morning oral surgery....yummy. 

Tom thank you for that effort, a great set of numbers. I'd be grateful if you would accept a HOWARDLY award for all of your work.

rdorgan wrote "My God, what is this, all these dem state chairman and/or secretaries of state giving no respect to the DNC and to Howard Dean in particular and to the American public as a whole?"

Just so the record’s clear, Brewer is one of the state chairs that stood up to the Bill Richardson’s and Rahm Emanuel’s who wanted Dean pushed out of the way at the top of the DNC, because he recognized that Dean was promoting the health of the state parties, not starving them like McAuliffe, Emanuel, and the other clown princes of the DLC/DNC axis.

Brewer reported at the party’s website that it would conduct the caucus in February, exactly as the national party’s rule require, regardless of the State’s legislatively revised primary schedule. It was only after Michigan Democrats contacted Dean to ask for fair treatment, following New Hampshire’s announcement that it would bump up its date to avoid being scooped by Nevada, that the Michigan Democratic caucus date got moved up. No one, Dean or anyone else, did anything about New Hampshire’s violation.

Under the law, a nonbreaching party is not bound to the obligations of a contract after the other contract party breaches unilaterally. Under these circumstances, can you come up with any good reason for Michigan to follow the national party rules? The only one that comes to me is the fear that favors and sanctions might be meted out by the DNC on a discriminatory basis. Of course, that’s a reason for not following them, too.

31.

jane d
Fri, 10/12/07
1:19 pm

Reply to this
Thanks, Tom, for all you've done.
One might wonder whether you were going to work for an old mentor, if he were planning a campaign or anything........
You know we're all giddy with the possibilities today.
Please keep in touch!
Jane


======

Yep -- we'll miss you Tom but is the 'private foundation' you're going to with Al? Can't help but wonder :~) (and hope)

New Hampshire hasn't jumped yet. and Iowa is on target for the original date too as far as I know, (and if there is to be a change I have a vote on it here in Iowa) but maybe you have a scoop Tom. I've been outside working.

I don't support DLC Blue Dog  hacks, Bearse (didn't vote for Michaud--twice; and I took heat for it).

Secondly, I'm unenrolled now--unless Al enters the race--he'd be a fool to do so now.

I support Tom & Chellie Pingree.

Got it?

Good, Denise that you saw Browne & Raitt last night (Boxer, also--she shoulda smacked Inhofe a few more times upside the haid w/that gavel)!

Huge fan of them both--Jude Johnstone (went to school w/her brothers) has written for (and played with) both of 'em.  Maine woman done good, indeedy.

"Wounded Heart" is a tear-jerker--great song. 

Thanks, Tom, for all the good work that you have done with and for DFA.

I wish you all continued success in your new endeavors.

rdorgan wrote "My God, what is this, all these dem state chairman and/or secretaries of state giving no respect to the DNC and to Howard Dean in particular and to the American public as a whole?"

Just so the record’s clear, Brewer is one of the state chairs that stood up to the Bill Richardson’s and Rahm Emanuel’s who wanted Dean pushed out of the way at the top of the DNC, because he recognized that Dean was promoting the health of the state parties,

+++

Tom -

Thanks for the response and I see, in the words of that Johnny Nash song "I Can See Clearly Now", the manuvers that NH has tried to get away with.  Well, I hope Phil in 59. is correct in thinking NH will stay put in Jan and not move (again) this time to early Dec.

Well, it sounds like a little too much "health of the state parties" has resulted ?  (a direct opposite of the McAuliffe's days)   I'm not happy at all with this whole prez election cycle scheduling this time around.  It seems like chaos.

mainefem wrote "I don't support DLC Blue Dog hacks, Bearse."

Sorry, I thought you did, because Tom Allen appears on the DLC membership list compiled early in this century, to which we get treated here with indigestible regularity. I suppose you’d know about it if you visited more often.

Believe me, the shock was rude to me, too, after hearing all the nice things you had to say about Rep. Allen. But, then again, Rep. Zoe Lofgren is also on the list, and I quoted her on a thread at length yesterday, railing against the scurrilous allegations leveled against candidate Howard Dean by Al Squeaky From and Bruce Reed in 2003.

I also commented in the past that Sen. Obama has disapproved of and distanced himself from similar membership claims made by the New Democrats, but was told here that he is a DLC lover anyway, regardless of whether he actually professes to be one or not, so, you know. I’m just telling you what I’ve been instructed is the truth. Don’t take it so hard.

Bill Gardner can do whatever he damned well wants in New Hampstuuh.  It's in their Constitution.

Dear Barbara,

I am deeply honored to receive the Nobel Peace Prize. This award is even more meaningful because I have the honor of sharing it with the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change--the world's pre-eminent scientific body devoted to improving our understanding of the climate crisis--a group whose members have worked tirelessly and selflessly for many years. We face a true planetary emergency. The climate crisis is not a political issue, it is a moral and spiritual challenge to all of humanity. It is also our greatest opportunity to lift global consciousness to a higher level.

My wife, Tipper, and I will donate 100 percent of the proceeds of the award to the Alliance for Climate Protection, a bipartisan non-profit organization that is devoted to changing public opinion in the U.S. and around the world about the urgency of solving the climate crisis.

Thank you,

Al Gore

Tom Allen is heavily supported by both Moveon.og; and by Blue America '08 (who vet heavily, thanks).

That's Moveon.org. 'Bout time they smartened up.

...as does Ned Lamont.

49.

Linda*in*SFNM
Fri, 10/12/07
1:55 pm


Thanks! I heard that Vice President Gore was amazing at Senator Boxer's event last evening. He moved folks to tears.

http://www.barbaraboxer.com/home

WUFT FM classical music station Friday trivia question (don't look it up):

Hector Berlioz composed his Harold in Italy for this famous violinist who ultimately never performed the piece. Who was the violinist?

70. Paganini (I got one!)

That's the event that Denise managed to crash/visit, Susan (Browne & Raitt were also there).

Oooooooh-lah-lah!

i.e., my reference to Boxer (nearly) nailing Inhofe upside the haid w/her gavel last spring...one of her finer moments on C-Span.

http://tinyurl.com/359qxp

Don't forget the Presidential Libary series on c-span this evening LIVE at 8 ET and 5 PT. Tonight is the LBJ library.

mainefem, don't take it so hard! LMAO :)

I'm with ya sistah.

Susan if you go back a few threads you'll see my reports on last night's event at the Westin St. Francis.

I managed to snag a button that says "elections have consequences" Boxer for Senate 2010. We need her right here in California.

And I was very much mistaken - the baby last night was Boxer's grandSON, not granddaughter. Hard to tell at that age - sorry little Boxer baby!

Video from last night

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJmoCQjKS...

Al Gore was late to accept his prize today........he had a very respectable stand in though.......congrats Mr President again!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVry0F9t3ls

Thanks Denise

Yay off to lunch with sweetie who I haven't seen in weeks. BBL

mainefem wrote "Tom Allen is heavily supported by both Moveon.org; and by Blue America '08 (who vet heavily, thanks)."

I saw that.  I probably shouldn't be so sarcastic.  

35. Huron John

http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/linkfra...

Democrats bow to Wall Street, saving tax break for billionaires
===================

The question is: How do we get Democrats (and Republicans) to support legislation for building a viable multi-party system?

We have the power.

The parties are made of individuals. A multi-party system is also made from individuals.

Frontal assaults to the two parties and threatening to run spoilers is out of the question. It just helps the worse of two evils.

In my few minutes here today I will say....Al Gore/Nobel Peace Prize...YEEEAAAHHHH!!!!

Tom Hughes...you will be missed, thank you for all you have done...gotta love that smile...
here he is at at our Peter Welch rally last year, front row on right...

OK, gotta run and see me elected ones...missing the Sox game...booooo...but a great day today already...maybe bbl

Thanks Tom for all the hard work, you will be missed

Jared Barrett in Murfreesboro, TN

mainefem wrote "Bill Gardner can do whatever he damned well wants in New Hampstuuh."

And is, apparently.  Here's part of the Michigan Democratic Party statment from 8/31/07:

"Michigan Democrats are taking this step in direct response to the New Hampshire Secretary of State’s statement of intent on August 9th, supported by the Democratic leadership of New Hampshire, to hold the New Hampshire primary before January 19, 2008, in direct violation of the DNC Rules that state that New Hampshire’s delegates cannot be selected at a primary held earlier than January 22, 2008.”

Susan, you're welcome., but the pictures got switched from lastnight to today's event.....do do do do do do.

Esp. when you don't know diddly about Maine politics.

This blog has gone to absolute shit for many reasons...the incessant vitriol & arguing is one of 'em (bullshit inept software is yet another--too late for that now).

I *do* know Maine/New England politics. I've vetted Tom's votes for years (although I don't reside in CD#1, I still track him--as well as the others).

Look for Sununu (find a real job--outa here, pal) & Jim Himes to go forward as a progressive, also (no more listening to whiny-assed Shays)...can't happen too soon!

The folks at Blue America '08 are vetting roll call votes heavily...no progressive Dems=no moula (which is exactly as it should be).

Same w/Lamont...he was up here for a few weeks this summer stumping F2F for Tom, Chellie, and the state party.

Those ActBlue accounts have spiffy built-in delete buttons; and I wouldn't hesitate to use it, if necessary. Every progressive should have an ActBlue account...vet thine own candidates, folks.

Again--it's common knowledge that NH (Bill Gardner, Sec. of State) has it written into their Constitution. They can primary in July, if necessary (which is an exaggeration, but damn, folks--lay off).

Why do you continue to argue & harp about something which cannot...and will not be changed...just for the helluvit?

Don't want to rain on Tom's farewell, but just must post this great summary of issues from BradBlog that are not getting play either in the MSM or with Congressional Dems. And mopre's the pity.

Thank God for Stephen Colbert.

Would that we could replace either Reid or Pelose with him. And Brad of BradBlog isn't so bad himself.

What on earth does it take to light a spark under these two idiots who are simply waiting out the clock?

=================
Stephen Colbert Video, Harry Reid Audio and the Mighty Lame Ducks of Congress...

I've been meaning to mention all week how appalling it was to see Tim Russert waste the entire sixty minutes of network airtime last week on NBC's Meet the Press, covering the 2008 Presidential Speculation. What, Ann Coulter was available for an "exclusive" full hour interview?

The vacuous hour followed a week on the heels of an extraordinary NY Times exposé on the con game played out by the Bush Administration concerning their torture policies; while America still has more than 160,000 troops committed to two hot wars; and with a criminal cabal still running full throttle out of the current White House.

Thankfully, Colbert mentioned it for me last night...

[...]
http://www.bradblog.com/?p=5154

mainefem wrote "Esp. when you don't know diddly about Maine politics."

Good point. I probably know as little about California politics, where Rep. Lofgren hales from. She’s the very first member of Congress to ever support Dean’s candidacy for president, and made this statement when From and Reed produced their noisome memo regarding Dean in 2003:

"When I go home every weekend, my constituents talk to me about health care, education and the economy. Dr. Howard Dean has an outstanding record of achievement in all of these areas. As governor, 96% of Vermont’s children had health coverage, and an additional 3% were eligible. He passed fiscally responsible budgets each and every year. He built a strong educational system, and as a result, Vermont’s students rank 6th in the country in overall performance. Dr. Dean’s record is one that ALL Democrats can be proud of.

"Al From and Bruce Reed spend a lot of time talking about myths in Democratic nominating process. I think it is more important to focus on the facts:

"Fact #1: Attacking fellow Democrats is wrong and will do nothing to help beat George W. Bush in 2004.

"Fact #2: Dr. Dean is a proven leader in the Democratic Party with a broad and growing base of support.

"Fact #3: Dr. Dean will be the Democratic Party’s nominee next year and will go on to beat George W. Bush.

"It is disappointing that From and Reed feel the need to rip into fellow Democrats. They should stop these misguided efforts, and spend their considerable resources on beating George W. Bush."

mainefem wrote "Why do you continue to argue & harp about something which cannot...and will not be changed...just for the helluvit?"

No, for the reason I’ve been writing over the past 2 days: because the DNC has already indicated it will sanction Florida and Michigan but not New Hampshire for violating national party rules concerning delegate selection.

Well, *mopre* s/b *more* ... argh!

*************
One last thing: I know that there are many here who do not agree with me on this, but passing the Armenian genocide resolution right now was just plain stupid.

Not to *dis* Armenian-Americans in any way, or to minimize the genocide, but we are really picking on the wrong people. In fact, one of my former colleagues, who is still a good friend, recently visited her Armenian mother's birthplace ... in Turkey. Her mother, who is my age, is a dual national: Turkish-Canadian.

Why is it that Canadians so often show more common sense than we Americans do? Why is it that we are generally so uninformed about the world as it is now, rather than as it was?

Juan Cole, no slouch when it comes to ME knowledge, agrees with me on this one.

No, I don't support putz's take on it; he and preceding governments have their own failings to answer for. But for this do-nothing Congress, that won't get us out of Iraq and won't impeach these bastards, to deliberately slime another country when it is not getting its own house in order is just plain stupid.

And it will have ... and is now having .. some very adverse consequences.

Stoo-pid, stoo-pid, stoo-pid.

=====================
Friday, October 12, 2007
Who Lost Turkey?

Turkey has been the strongest ally that the United States has had in the Middle East since the end of WW II. The Marshall Plan started with Northern tier states like Turkey and Greece. Turkey joined NATO and was a key player in the American victory in the Cold War. As a secular government, Turkey stood against the rising tide of Muslim radicalism. To the extent that Turkey is moderating its long-term secular militancy, and moving toward fair elections, it may be providing a model for a moderate, democratic Middle East. Its economy is growing rapidly, foreign investment is in the billions. Turkey is in short, almost everything the US could have asked for in the Middle East.

But the Bush administration has, during the past five years, increasingly thrown away this asset, and now is in danger of losing a close and valued ally altogether. It is unclear what US interests are served by this repeated and profound damage inflicted by Washington on Turkey, or what Ankara ever did to us that we are treating them so horribly. (The dismissive treatment in some ways began when the US promised Turkey $1 bn in aid to offset the damage to its economy of the Gulf War in 1990-1991, but then Congress formally decided by the mid-1990s to renege on the pledge. No one has ever explained why we stiffed them.)

[...]
Imagine what things look like from a Turkish point of view. Remember that Turkey is a NATO ally, that it stood with the US during the Korean War (in which its troops fought), during the Cold War, and during Bush's war on terror. Turkey gives the US military facilities, including the Incirlik Air Force base, through which large amounts of materiel for the US forces in northern Iraq flows.

[...]
PKK guerrillas have just killed 13 Turkish troops on Sunday and in the past few weeks have killed 28 altogether. If guerrillas were raiding over the border into the United States and had killed 28 US troops I think I know what Washington's response would be.

The the US Congress abruptly condemned modern Kemalist Turkey for the Armenian genocide, committed by the Ottoman Empire, provoking Ankara to withdraw its ambassador from Washington. I have long held that Turkey should acknowledge the genocide, which killed hundreds of thousands and displaced more hundreds of thousands. The Turkish government could then point out that it was committed by a tyrannical and oppressive government-- the Ottoman Empire-- against which the Kemalists also fought a long and determined war to establish a modern republic. I can't understand Ankara's unwillingness to distance itself from a predecessor it doesn't even think well of--the junta of Enver Pasha and the later pusillanimity of the sultan (the capital is in Ankara and not Istanbul in part for this very reason!)

But no dispassionate observer could avoid the conclusion that the Congressional vote condemning Turkey came at a most inopportune time for US-Turkish diplomacy, at a time when Turks were already raw from watching the US upset all the apple carts in their neighborhood, unleash existential threats against them, cause the rise of Salafi radicalism next door, coddle terrorists killing them, coddle the separatist KRG, and strengthen the Shiite ayatollahs on their borders.

[...]
http://www.juancole.com/

The good news today is Al Gore's Nobel Prize.

The bad news is today is Tom Hughes last day with DFA.

Can't win them all.

Good luck Tom, I know you have a brillian future waiting for you out there.

passing the Armenian genocide resolution right now was just plain stupid.

To me, it's rank hypocrisy considering Congress has yet to condenm the genocide against America's own people which ended just a few decades before what happened in Armenia. Americans have no business condemning other peoples about anything until we clean up our own act and our own history.

92.

Judy,

I agree with you 100% even before I heard about Turkey's objection. Congress has so many more important things to do right now. Why this stumbling block?

Good luck Tom, I know you have a brillian future waiting for you out there.

Hopefully he'll be working on Gore's campaign before long. 

Thanks, Sitka & Joan ... you make me feel a bit better. I see and hear so much on this side of The Pond from people whose families are being directly and adversely affected by so many of our short-sighted policies that it literally makes my heart break at times.

It's even worse where you are, I know, when it's the short-sighted domestic policies that Congress deals ... or doesn't deal ... with. Having this distance is the only thing that keeps me semi-sane on those policies, and I am fighting mad about my sister's useless HMO as it is.

But seeing Congress then take unneeded steps to make us all hated throughout the world even more than we are now is the last straw.

Thank God for Al. He is genuinely admired and perhaps some of that admiration will rub off for a little bit.

************
My last for tonight: Clarence Thomas seen for what he is: a whiny bastard and a scab on the a** of progress.

==============
Marianne Means: Clarence Thomas' whiny book
By MARIANNE MEANS
Copyright 2007 Hearst Newspapers

In future histories of Supreme Court justices, Clarence Thomas will certainly be ranked near the bottom. He betrays the high court's high standards with nearly every mean-spirited, ideologically driven vote he has cast. But the ultimate, most revealing act of hostility is his new memoir, titled My Grandfather's Son, in which he portrays himself as Mr. Perfect, without a selfish political thought. His racial persecution complex is scary. He's risen to one of the most powerful jobs in the land and he still thinks evil white liberals are out to get him solely because of his color, not because they profoundly disagree with his opinions. He completely reflects White House Republican thinking — never admit a single mistake, no matter what. Yet he's supposed to bring a well-reasoned judicial temperament to tricky legal decisions that impact a lot of American lives, both white and black. His opposition to college affirmative action policies is particularly offensive, considering how he got into Yale law school with the help of a program to give black students a break.

He sounds insulted by the existence of the program, but he took advantage of it anyway. Let me digress. I am one-half of a politically divided household, in which fortunately both my husband, conservative columnist James J. Kilpatrick, and I understand that in matters of the heart there are more important things than politics.

But we do have some heartburn moments, and we are having one now. As editor of the Richmond (Va.) News-Leader, Jack was for decades the most prominent intellectual voice of the segregationist South. But eventually he came to recant segregation and sympathize with its impact upon oppressed blacks — and particularly ambitious males like Thomas with whose conservative views he agrees. He believes Thomas when he denies Anita Hill's charges of sexual harassment. I do not. I believe Hill and admire her courage in standing up to a man who had been her boss but acted in an abusive manner.

[...]
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/edit...

96.

The same thought had passed my mind Sitka. Fingers crossed.

The DNC's national rules committee cannot "sanction" NH's Constitution.

http://www.sos.nh.gov/rsa653.htm

I don't agree w/the philosophy; however, it is indeed reality.

MI & FLA are shit outa luck.

It's time to let go of harping.

watching race relations in Louisiana the past few years I have some empathy for the seething anger that comes out of Clarence Thomas, from his childhood in the rural south. I have no idea how you can translate that into even-handed justice though.

Iowa's Constitution says we "caucus". get over that one too State law here says we go eight days ahead of the "first primary".

Party rules do over-rule State Law in regards to seating delegates to the National Convention. since that is true I do have a vote in the matter as a member of the State Central Committee. I'll never vote for a December date. 

mainefem wrote "The DNC's national rules committee cannot "sanction" NH's Constitution."

No, just not permit candidates to campaign in the state or seat delegates to the convention. The provisions of the New Hampshire's Constitution and the DNC Delegate Selection Rules are therby both upheld.

Mz*Little and all others who missed the Press Conference of Al Gore on his Nobel Peace Award,

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/10/12/nobel.gore/index.html#cnnSTCVideo 

There would be a tactical advantage to knowing who the Republican nominee is before we pick ours. but whoever they are we know they will stick with big oil, the mega rich, and war. But I say let them have Michigan and Florida primary tests. They are spinning their anti-Gore *sses off today so I know they are terrified of that prospect.

Link 

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/10/12/nobel.gore/index.html#cnnSTCVideo

Phil wrote "I'll never vote for a December date."

Because you understand that Iowa would thereby lose its delegates to the convention. 

...and Anita Hill is still speaking out against intersections of misogyny & race:

http://tinyurl.com/yslfyv

F^ck Clarence Thomas & his so-called "high-tech lynching."

The GOP party=Gas Oil Petroleum

That's correct, Phil.

IA & NH are the only two states who are "covered," so to speak.

Deadlines have already passed; and that's just reality during this cycle. FLA & MI can go pound sand up their butts.

mainefem wrote "Deadlines have already passed; . . ."

What does this mean?

Two of the candidates personally asked me to keep Iowa first. (what else would they say to an Iowan?) but one was putting it in terms of the time and money already invested and was concerned that it might change "at this late date".

just messing with it at all favors money endowed versus people endowed, even if it doesn't change

I'm sure the networks would like just one national primary so they could set up at the studio and not have to move the trucks around

part of the eight days between Iowa and New Hampshire was an accomodation to the press

the way everyone is adding staff here I know Florida and Michigan moves backfired for them because the campaigns are focusing even more here

97.  i think Justice Thomas has a guilt complex and is in denial.  He feels guilty about the preferences he received (and couldn't resist) and he wants to save others from that guilt.

What he completely fails to understand is that it wasn't about him at all.  Affirmative action isn't about the people who are treated fairly; it's about people who want to do the right thing, pick the best person for a position, and need the backing of a law to "protect" them from retribution from those who think THEY deserve a preference because of the color of their skin.

Segregation was always maintained  (in america's case) by whites enforcing a standard of behavior on other whites who wanted to maintain their position in their community.  Which is why most integration has taken place among poor whites and blacks who have no social status to lose.

Ostracism is a very effective strategy because it strips people of the benefits (connections mainly) they have to offer and then, of course, they're no use either to themselves or those they want to help.  One result is that only those at the very top of the heap, whose status is beyond challenge, can afford to be magnanimous and lift up the downtrodden in a consumate act of charity.  That's what they did to Clarence Thomas.  What's really sad is that he feels guilty and they get to feel self-satisfied.  And he has no idea who his real enemies are.  It doesn't occur to most people that gifts can be poisonous.  In German "Gift" means poison.  

Phil wrote "the way everyone is adding staff here I know Florida and Michigan moves backfired for them because the campaigns are focusing even more here."

This is absolutely true, except for one thing: The news cycle discussion last August of an Iowa caucus or a New Hampshire primary moving into December helped draw attention to how badly the system is broken, and how poorly it serves the party.  Maybe this consciousness-raising will pay off in the future.

The truly shocking element to this for me is the Chairman's reluctance to tell New Hampshire exactly what he told Michigan and Florida in forceful terms, namely, that the delegate selection rules impose immutable time constraints on the states.

Delegate selection rules vary by state. My guess is Tom doesn't know how Michigan selects the actual people who represent them in Denver, but here in Iowa only half are actually apportioned by the caucus and none selected, and those would be the ones effected by DNC sanctions if Iowa jumped to December on our own like Mich. did, and we would have it coming.

102.  Dodd is pulling his operatives out of New Hampshire and counting on the grass roots to carry on alone.  Having seven offices here struck me as excessive, anyway, but I expect the staff got some good experience.  I think what we have to work on is making the connection between the internet connected people and people in the neighborhoods.  The DNC is going to help some there--setting up neighborhood get-togethers to spur interest in the democratic process.  There's still a little bit of resistance on the part of party regulars.  They're sort of at the "what are you DOING?" stage as if we were supposed to be waiting for direction.  LOL

Phile wrote "here in Iowa only half are actually apportioned by the caucus and none selected, and those would be the ones effected by DNC sanctions if Iowa jumped to December on our own like Mich. did, and we would have it coming."

What if New Hampshire jumps to a date before January 22nd?  Should it have DNC sanctions coming?  

(103) THANK YOU LINDA!!!!!

Tom

maybe it is because nothing has been done to change the calendar?

so far it is all speculation

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

the anti-gore troll is a little slow today lol

I also agree with Judy about the genocide.  Why now?  And my answer is.....it's being done on purpose.  After all, isn't destroying democracies what this regime does best?  It can't ever take the log outta its own eye.

I did catch Al's statement and picked up on how best to use this award.  AS PRESIDENT, and no other way will be as effective.  The RW can smear all it wants and this time, I don't think it'll work.

I saw the new acupuncturist and think he may be OK.  I'll see how I feel tomorrow, but am much better today.  On the way home I bought (all natural) 3 lovely tomatos, one huge cucumber, a large head of interesting-looking lettuce and one lemon (for those dark circles I'll have when I start dancing till the wee hours, soon)  .... all for U.S $1.67.  The acupuncture treatment was $16 and change. Food and services are cheap here..clothes are not, except for leather.  Tango shoes are about U.S. $80 and double that in the states.

I know this is not exciting tango/travel news, but it's the best I can do for now.  Oh, Gardel has a sweetheart and they're both on the railing singing and eyeing the bread crumbs.

An American girlfriend, Kristin, (a good dancer who lives here) and I are planning a trip to a hot springs in Uruguay and I may go to an estancia (ranch) to play with the gauchos and horsie-back ride if I can ever get all my groins healed enuf to straddle a horsie. LOL  (one friend quipped, "You probably can't have sex either," which is moot since I'm waiting for my gov't check to not have sex.  (I miss Firefox.)

Now there are two doves munching away.  It's amazing how such little things give me so much pleasure. 

I never get a lot of feed back to what I write.  So, when I do, I consider it significant.  Lately I've been getting people volunteering that they don't like the coronation of the front runners.

I still have my school reservation for a Jan. 14th caucus, and Michigan gambled and lost.

Once the gavel convenes the Convention a majority of those seated by Credentials have the final word. The disputed credentials will be either meaningless and pro-forma or very, very important and the start of a long and interesting convention.

Phil wrote "maybe it is because nothing has been done to change the calendar?"

Maybe, maybe not.  The Michigan Demcratic Party had already announced a caucus date of February 9th until The New Hampshire Secretary of State announced his intention to adjust the New Hampshire primary schedule to a date that is in violation of the national party rules.  The sanctions have been made conditional on scheduling the selection process, not the primary or caucus, in conformance with the party rules.  In other words, if the premature contests are beauty contests, the delegates could be lawfully selected and then be seated.

New Hampshire's primary, if not its selection process, will be, by its Constitution, in violation of the rules.  Has there been any threat of conditional sanctions against it?  Why not?

Tom, may the wind always be at your back.  Thank you for being here.

thanks for the report seashell, enjoy life's little pleasures, they are the best kind

I have a lime plugged milking parlor drain and went to the machine shop to have a custom auger built so I can play Ed Norton and get down in the trenches. Politics could be a pleasant diversion if we weren't at war, and it didn't have real consequences.

back to work for me, later

Phil wrote "I still have my school reservation for a Jan. 14th caucus, and Michigan gambled and lost."

You don't have the problem that New Hampshire has, because January 14th is clearly within the time provided in the delegate selection rules.

Monica

Hillary has support of upper twenties strong and so does Edwards with Obama more fluid, and room for one of the others to catch fire

that other could be Gore, there is still time for several more weeks, but it isn't months anymore

but with no one breaking away there really isn't a "front runner", and since there is a "top tier" (plural) there can be no "coronation".

all of the ones that have been working hard have impressive supporter lists, until you realize that they all have lists so they become less impressive

Al Gore..Nobel Peace Price recipient..thank you very much.....thank you very much............

http://youtube.com/watch?v=q_n-cf5YPHQ

Ron Paul Wins Debate In Another Landslide
Congressman comes out on top despite being given least time, least questions and despite CNBC pulling its poll half way through

Ron Paul won another debate by a landslide this week despite efforts on the part of the mainstream media to limit the Congressman's exposure and to force Rudy Giuliani down the necks of viewers.

According to an MSNBC online poll participated by over 22,000 people, Texas Congressman Ron Paul won the Tuesday night GOP Michigan debate in a landslide.

As shown in the screenshot, when asked who they thought was standing out from the pack, Paul received 86% of the online vote.

Critics have again charged that the polls were deluged by Ron Paul internet spammers. Recently hacks such as Sean Hannity and others have suggested their own polls have been fixed simply because Ron Paul won them.

In a familiar move CNBC even removed its own poll on Tuesday night just hours after the debate had ended when they realized Ron Paul was winning by such a wide margin.

Many Neo-Con blog sites do not even include Ron Paul in their polls anymore because too many people are voting for him! This is not as a result of one person voting multiple times, as in all the online polls only one vote per IP address is allowed, but the operators of the site simply don't like Ron Paul and have chosen to ignore reality and pretend that he doesn't exist.

In another poll this week, so called "conservative" bloggers listed Paul as their most hated "person on the right", even though he is the most conservative Congressman in office!

In addition to CNBC pulling their poll, and continued attacks on the Congressman, the anchors of the debate on Tuesday night only allowed Paul a total of 5:44 minutes to speak, just over 6.5% of the time allotted in total to all candidates. In addition Dr Paul was only asked 7 questions, where as Giuliani and Fred Thompson were both asked over double that amount.

 See opposite for the figures (courtesy Marc Parent )

Ron Paul wowed viewers once again both during the debate and afterwards as he slammed the candidates who willingly accepted the idea of striking Iran from the air without the authorization of Congress:

"Why don't we just open up the Constitution and read it? You're not allowed to go to war without a declaration of war. Now, as far as fleeting enemies goes, yes-- if there's an imminent attack on us. We've never had that happen to us in 220 years. The idea that Iran could pose an imminent attack on the United States is preposterous. There's no way."

"This is just war propaganda preparing this nation to go to war and spread this war not only into Iraq but into Iran unconstitutionally. It is a road to disaster for us as a nation. It is the road to our financial disaster if we don't read the Constitution once in a while."

Afterwards the Congressman hit out at the current Administration, describing them as "all big government people" and calling for massive cuts in spending.

Watch the highlights of the debate:

NANCY PELOSI AND THE ARROGANCE OF POWER

http://www.counterpunch.org/

They are advocates. We are leaders."

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi in regards to "Anti-war activists."

People of America, this is truly the problem with what was once a Representative Republic and now is a country run by "elected" officials who believe that they, individually and collectively, are above any accountability and are not answerable to their constituents. Our public servants erroneously believe that they are the leaders!

Ms. Pelosi made this statement to a group of reporters at a luncheon recently and she also went off on activists who have been participating in vigils outside of her chi-chi home in the Pacific Heights district of San Francisco. The people who are vigiling outside her house regularly, in a <http://www.pelosiwatch.org/>Pelosi Watch are only exercising their rights as American citizens to make their concerns known to a Rep who was elected from a district that is wholeheartedly against the occupation of Iraq and for impeaching the liars who got us into the illegal and immoral situation.

No, Ms. Pelosi, you are not a leader. You have proven time and again in what you laughably believe is a "mistake" free run as Speaker of a Democratic House that you will do anything to protect an Imperial Presidency to the detriment of this Nation and the world, particularly the people of Iraq and Afghanistan.

This Democratic Congress supported BushCo's disastrous and deadly surge; handed him over billions of their constituent's tax dollars to wage this murder; have by their silence and votes countenanced an invasion of another country; approved more restrictions on the rights of the citizenry to be protected against unreasonable search and seizure; Ms. Pelosi does not even know if "torture" (which violates international law and the 8th Amendment in our Bill of Rights) is an impeachable offense; and worst of all the impeachment clauses were taken "off the table" in an ongoing partnership with BushCo to make the office of the presidency a Congressionally protected crime conglomerate that is rapidly sending this Nation down a crap-hole of fascism. So, Congress has led us to a few things: war, poverty, oppression, unemployment, and an inexplicable continuance of the Bush Regime.

No, Ms Pelosi, you are not even a leader in the very narrowest of definitions. We do not elect our Congressional Representatives to be leaders, not to be used as willing marionettes for the war machine and other special interests that serve the elite to the detriment of the rest of us, but to represent the will of the people. We send our elected officials to DC and pay their salaries and subsidize their benefits to do the "Will of the People."

GO CINDY!

We have the right to hold both of the political parties accountable. We not only have the right, we have the responsibility.

We not only have the right and the responsibility we have the power

190,424

Over 50,000 have signed the Gore petition since the NYT ad.

1963 have signed the DFA/Gore petition. 

http://www.opednews.com/maxwrite/diarypage.php?did=4616

It's time we called the Democrats and Pelosi what they actually are.  Their refusal to stop funding for this war, their failure to impeach Bush and Cheney, their failure to reopen the 9/11 investigation, all points to the fact that they are MURDERERS

You could have just said that yourself, HJ.

Biden's gutsy proposal for Iraq

By Scot Lehigh, Globe Columnist | October 10, 2007

PLYMOUTH, N.H

... The US embassy in Iraq issued a patently disingenuous warning that "attempts to partition or divide Iraq by intimidation, force, or others means" would lead to "extraordinary suffering and bloodshed."

But Biden's isn't a partition plan. Further, the Iraq constitution permits just such a federalized system. Nor is the idea to impose such an arrangement, but rather to work with the UN, Iraq, and its neighbors to promote decentralization.

Ryan Crocker, the US ambassador to Iraq, knows better, avers Biden, who says that on a recent trip to Iraq, he spent hours with Crocker. That's why Biden suspects that the embassy's statement may have been ordered up by the White House to diminish the Senate vote.

"I know that there are a number of serious players in the administration who agree with me, at State and Defense," the senator says. "What I also know is there is very strong pushback from [Vice President] Cheney and from the White House . . . What I hoped this would do was embolden those within the administration who do not agree with the policy of Cheney and company to stand up and push back, now that they know they have a lot of support in the Senate."

Despite initial criticism, apparently based on the partition misunderstanding, Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki has since spoken more positively of Biden's plan, as has Iraqi President Jalal Talabani....

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articl...

l just saw part of a BBC interview with Musharaf who said, and I paraphrase, that the people in DC and our media haven't a clue what to do in the ME nor understand the problems it faces.  He went on to say that the U.S. promised Pakistan  150 milliion a year for 5 years to help fight terrorism and Pakistan has not received "one penny." Yet the US continues to pressure Pakistan to do more.  Pi$$ing off Pakistan is very dangerous and it's apparently happening.  Our pols paint rosy pictures of how well we get along with others.  Their story is very different.

Then it covered a part of the wildly unsuccessful talks between Condi and her counterpart with them ending no longer as *friends.*...meaning the US and  Russia are now on the verge of another *cold* war and Russia is dusting off her arms. 

If these monsters stay in office any longer, they'll pi$$ off every planet in the galaxy.

And now to toot my own horn.  I didn't like or trust Pelosi from the very beginning and said so here.  Same goes for Clinton.

Argentina's prez election coming up in a few days and la Sra. Kirchner is favored to win....but.....the women here don't like her becuz she doesn't fit the stereotypical Argentine concept of what women are or are for.  I don't have a clue what that means but I do think that the women here are not very interested in politics, in general, whereas the men are.   From what I hear, the men, in general, like her because she's very hip politically and very intelligent and savvy about world affairs.  Argentine men generally like smart sassy women so I fit in well.  :-) 

A BBC talking head just said that if a repug wins in 08, Gore will run in 2012 and if a dem wins in 08, he'll run in 2016.  He doesn't think Gore wants to go from a Nobel Prize to munching corn in IA which we know he wouldn't do.

Perhaps he'll back Dodd and then win in 2016.  Works for me if he doesn't run now. 

The talking head said that going up against the Clinton machine would be disastrous for Al.

Maybe...but the bush/clinton machine won't give up power...ever. 

Sliming Graeme Frost

By PAUL KRUGMAN
Published: October 12, 2007

Two weeks ago, the Democratic response to President Bush’s weekly radio address was delivered by a 12-year-old, Graeme Frost. Graeme, who along with his sister received severe brain injuries in a 2004 car crash and continues to need physical therapy, is a beneficiary of the State Children’s Health Insurance Program....

Soon after the radio address, right-wing bloggers began insisting that the Frosts must be affluent because Graeme and his sister attend private schools (they’re on scholarship), because they have a house in a neighborhood where some houses are now expensive (the Frosts bought their house for $55,000 in 1990 when the neighborhood was rundown and considered dangerous) and because Mr. Frost owns a business (it was dissolved in 1999)....

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/12/opinio...

 Dear Tom,

Thank you, thank you, thank you!  Your mark on DFA will be evident for many years to come.  Best of luck to you in whatever you do.  I must say, I'm curious where you'll be next - you have such good political taste and instincts!  Please stay in touch via the blog.

 Dear Al Gore,

Congratulations!  The world is indebted to you for your dedication, courage and wisdom - thank you so much!  What a year - Oscar, Nobel prize - hmm, let's see, what could you do to make this a Trifecta?!

 Dear Howard Dean,

I lisrtened to part of your virtual debate with college students on CSPAN this morning and am happy to say you sound just like you always do - YOU still have the power!  Thank you, Howard!

Dear States that follow NH and IA in the Presidential primaries,

I'm sure you're feeling that this year is THE year to challenge the way the primaries work - you've gained an inch on those darn 'first in the nation' states and now many of you are looking for a mile.  I must say - be careful what you ask for.  with 50 states in the nation seeing 'an opening' you may not be very satisfied with the end result.

Gore's getting a lot of press on the BBC tonight.

BTW, it's 9:04 pm here. 

Putin:  "The only place Russia and the US can meet on the missile defense system is on the moon."

Tom Hughes is first.  Thank you for being here Tom.  All the best to you.

Cle 1

Bos 5

going to the top of the 4th

BTW, it's 9:04 pm here.

< Where are you, dear little ill(?) one.

Remember the folks, Tom - the ordinary people.

http://www.npr.org/programs/asc/

Neil Young

CD: Chrome Dreams II
Song: "Ordinary People"
Label: Reprise

Listen to "Ordinary People"

137.

Some reasons why the BBC person might be mistaken:

1.) Unless Gore endorses Clinton, he will already be opposing "the Clinton machine" and therefore might as well run.

2.) Gore won't endorse Clinton, so he might as well run.

3.) Whoever Gore does endorse will not receive the nomination, just like Howard didn't. Two strikes doesn't help him, might as well run.

4.) He has momentum now, might have lost it by then, might as well run.

5.) If Al Gore cares more for his personal strategy than for the welfare of this country, I won't vote for him in 20-whatever. Hillary needs to be stopped now, and so do all those GOPs, might as well run.

6.) How many candidates have actual military wartime experience? Let's see... McCain, Gravel, Paul, Hunter, none of whom are in any danger of winning, might as well run, Al.

Plus, I suspect Howard has encouraged him to run. Just my own personal hinky feeling.

It's now or never, Al. No more royal families for us!! So run already.

-- volney

Oh, yeah, reason #7 -- why on earth would Gore want to wait around and then need to run against either an incumbent GOP president or a sitting Dem VP?

Nope, now is the time and he is the person he's been waiting for.

-- volney

147. Yes, thank you.

Wait until 2012 or 2016 for What? We won't have anything to run for.

This is his momentum on the right issues. Now.

Now,
now it's
Time for a COOL change,
Gore
2008

And David Sirota and Greg Palast go SH!T IN YOUR HATS!

Sirota on Edwards campaign, doing the hit and run like he did for Sherrod Brown (sitka, because he worked for Brown)

Taking to trashing Al Gore on his day of winning the Nobel Peace Prize on Clinton's NAFTA, calling it Gore's, when I think they are supposed to know that Al Gore was VP.

And Greg Palast being a condescending smart @ss and saying "Al where are you, why don't you call in"?


I couldn't find a phone number to call in to call them out on their lies and attacks. I wonder if Edwards was in agreement on this attack. Did he really think that would help him? How Trippi?

Gore Campaign 2000

Al Gore on Free Trade

Link trade to environment and labor. (Sep 2000)
Fair trade: standards for child labor & environment. (Aug 2000)

You all better hope Al Gore does run, because for sure now, that is the only way a Democrat will get my vote.

I'm off.

148.

Your Al slogan made me think of a t-shirt my store sells for junior girls, sponsored by the World Wildlife Federation. It says, "Hotter than I ought to be." :-D

Reason #8:

Al checkmates the Hillary smear machine. How on earth does she campaign against him? "My husband's activist VP of 8 years is a nitwit?"

What would that say about her own judgment? There are soundbites apleanty of both of them saying what a great guy Al is.

-- volney

CA GOVERNOR SAYS "NO" TO PNEUMOCOCCAL VACCINE MANDATE

...California's premiere autism activist, Rick Rollens, got word yesterday that the Governor issued the following statement explaining his veto:

"I am returning Senate Bill 533 without my signature. While I am a strong proponent of prevention and support efforts to improve vaccine rates for children, I am unable to sign this bill as California's public health experts believe it is not needed. The Department of Public Health can already require young children receive the pneumococcal vaccine. California's vaccine experts have not established a mandate because they believe it is not needed. Approximately 86 percent of children are already being vaccinated under a voluntary system. For this reason, I am returning this bill without my signature."

http://vaccineawakening.blogspot.com/sea...

NAFTA was a brilliant idea if the jobs that went to China had actually gone to the Americas. If that had happened, no illegal immigration probs today, in fact we'd probably be moving down there, hola!!

-- volney

http://www.teamsterslocal25.com/autism-vid.html

And BTW we are walking for Autism in Sunday October 14th

If you missed Howard Dean on C-span today, his speech and Q&A at John Hopkins will repeat at a few minutes part 11:00 PM EDT tonight. It's about an hour long.

What a great man! He hasn't changed much at all except that his speaking is much smoother and every more confident and knowledgable than ever before. What a different country/world this would be if he had been prez.

bbl

WOW, did you see Apple's Home page?

http://www.apple.com/


...very nice!

Correction:

Howard dean will be on C-Span II (not than C-Span) at 11:09 PM EDT tonight.

9-2 Boston, Bottom of 6th, 0 out, Bases loaded 

Mike Lowell up 

Go, Apple!!!  And then go buy a MAC, ya'll.  It's a stunning machine.

I think Al should run too, but the Clinton/Bush machine will try and take him down.  I'd hate to see such filth and corruption thrown at him, yet I think it would be counterproductive to Clinton, showing her mean colors like that - dissing a Nobel Peace Prize winner.  Yep, she'd have to swallow her gall and then lose the nomination.

One little anecdote about the acupuncture today.  They certainly don't stand on modesty ceremony here.  No sheets, just take off your pants (leaving me in my bikinis) lie down and here's where I'll put the needles.  And the table didn't seem to have those throw away paper sheets so I wondered how many people had laid down on it.

When Dr. Luciano met me, he shook my hand.  When he said goodbye, he kissed my cheek.  Gotta love these Latins and all the kissing. 

Paine, I'm in Buenos Aires...and feeling 90% better since Luciano's needles!  :-) 

What a life!  Accupuncture in Buenos Aires with formal hand shaking yielding quickly to familiar cheek to cheek.  I need to get a V8 life.

Thanks for the heads up Joan :)

Back home on a rainy Friday night as the sun sets. Got any tunes, Paine?

Denise 

146.

and my boy at 154 has some background music.

Oh, and the sound of the fans at Fenway Park is music to me ;)

May the road rise to meet you and the wind be ever at your back, Tom.

And keep your ear to the road for when to go work for Al Gore's next Presidential Campaign!

(Tell him we really need him!)

Peace

~ listener in VT 

thelonius monk quartet with john coltrane  crepuscule with nellie   at carnegie hall          0:37:39 (Real | MP3 | Pop‑up)

http://www.wfmu.org/playlists/shows/24860

via National Nurse Teri:


George Clooney to direct and star in a political thriller loosely based on the campaign of Howard Dean.

http://www.femalefirst.co.uk/entertainment/George+Clooney-42017.html 

Does anyone remember Beau Willimon?

Paine, don't forget that in between the hand shaking and cheek kissing, there was panty viewing!  LOL

I used to read sirota every day and agreed with just about everything. But that Brown/Hackett smear exposed him as a hack and I haven't been back since. Now he's doing it to Gore in favor of Edwards? Doesn't surprise me a bit. 

Here's an even better link about the Howard Dean film:

http://www.eonline.com/news/article/index.jsp?uuid=d1ca3e56-d7a7-44c6-8e88-c27ff17ce752&sid=fd-hot2-txt 

William S. Burroughs  Spare Ass Annie           2:42:19 (Real | MP3 | Pop‑up) http://www.wfmu.org/playlists/shows/24857

Go Red Sox! For the AL. I'm also rooting for the Rockies in the NL.

Thanks for the tunz, Paine. I'm d/l'ing the CD my buddy in Santa Fe burned for me while I was there last weekend. Great thrill to find Angel from Montgomery duet with Bonnie Raitt and John Prine on there.

She's a trip, my friend. Linda you have to meet her someday.

She included a whole bunch of Chicago band hits, like the Cryin' Shames, The Buckinghams, New Colony Six, and those one hit wonders we all forget about like "Nobody But Me" by the Human Beinz. Takes me waaaaay back.

Un fuc@ing be leavable

WASHINGTON, Oct. 12— In a sweeping indictment of the four-year effort in Iraq, the former top American commander called the Bush administration’s handling of the war incompetent and warned that the United States was “living a nightmare with no end in sight.”

In one of his first major public speeches since leaving the Army in late 2006, retired Lt. Gen. Ricardo S. Sanchez blamed the administration for a “catastrophically flawed, unrealistically optimistic war plan” and denounced the current “surge” strategy as a “desperate” move that will not achieve long-term stability.

“After more than fours years of fighting, America continues its desperate struggle in Iraq without any concerted effort to devise a strategy that will achieve victory in that war-torn country or in the greater conflict against extremism,” Mr. Sanchez said, at a gathering here of military reporters and editors.

[...]

“There was been a glaring and unfortunate display of incompetent strategic leadership within our national leaders,” he said, adding later in his remarks that civilian officials have been “derelict in their duties” and guilty of a “lust for power.”

The White House had no initial comment.

Just in from our Vermont rally. Too tired to blog about me entire night but had a good discussion with Leahy re: his vote on the Coryn resolution. Breaks down to negative campaigning and ads which he is against. Told me of the loss of votes from the other aisle because of the ad also. I told him of the loss of the feet on the ground willing to do the volunteer work for the Dem. party because of his vote. Then talked to one of his staff and we'll go from there...we were cordial to one another and I did my pic with him which I'll post along with many others tomorrow...(found a DFA member and her son there). So I'll let you all guess...I'm pooped for the night.

zzzville...

LOL...she even has the Singing Nun Dominique on here...LMAO

General Sanchez is the most senior in a string of retired generals to harshly criticize the administration’s conduct of the war. Asked following his remarks why he waited nearly a year after his retirement to outline his views, he responded that that it was not the place of active duty officers to challenge lawful orders from civilian authorities. General Sanchez, who is said to be considering a book, promised further public statements criticizing officials by name.

“The administration, Congress and the entire inter-agency, especially the State Department, must shoulder responsibility for the catastrophic failure, and the American people must hold them accountable,” General Sanchez said.

Dean on C-Span 2 at 11:00

http://inside.c-spanarchives.org:8080/cspan/schedule.csp

Well, actually 11:08.  I know it was the Milton Eisenhower Symposium, but this seems to be an interview with Steve Scully...not sure. 

11:08 PM EDT
0:57 (est.)
 Speech
Democratic Party Campaign Issues
Johns Hopkins University
Howard Dean , Democratic National Committee 

Here's a quote or two about the primaries.

http://www.extrememortman.com/presidential-election/state-of-dean-ial/

"Interesting positioning by DNC chairman Howard Dean on the upcoming Democratic presidential primaries. On C-SPAN he calls it “incredibly unlikely” that Feb. 5th will lock up the Dem nomination.

Here’s Dean, appearing before a Denver University political science class taught by C-SPAN’s Steve Scully

Steve Scully: “Governor, you talked about 1976 and we’ve talked about it in this class when Jimmy Carter ran in January, Feb, and didn’t lock up the nomination until June of 1976. And now ostensibly by February 5th, this process will be completed. Is that good or bad?”

Howard Dean: “It is incredibly unlikely that it’ll be completed on February 5th. I think one of two things will happen; we have a pretty strong field this year, so either someone will sweep three or four of the first four, and they’ll have locked it up by January 29th or whenever it is. Or they’ll split the first four fairly evenly,in which case they’ll split the February 5th states and we won’t know who the nominee is –most likely– until sometime in March."

“If I could push a button and do anything I wanted, I’d move this whole thing back, but there’s been this tug of war over who’s going to go first for a long time. And in 2012, I think we’re going to have to do something fairly drastic to fix this. Because we can’t go on with this sort of disorder. We need real order in the primary process and we also need fairness and inclusiveness to every region in the country and every group of voters in the process.”

Amen Governor.

The only way to treat all voters equally is to give them all a chance to vote at the same time. But it doesn't have to be one day it can be absentee only and over several weeks so campaigns can continue and the outcome known later in the calendar. start March First and run six weeks

the outcome needs to be counted at theCongressional District level to properly allocate the nominating convention delegates

I challenge all of you to come up with a fairer system than one that treats every voter equally like I propose.

Gotta hit the hay.  Night all.  be well.

Howard on CSPAN-2 on the leftcoast now

10-Oct-2007 5 | US: 5 | UK: 0 | Other: 0

US Staff Sergeant Eric T. Duckworth Baghdad Hostile - hostile fire - IED attack
US Specialist Samuel F. Pearson Camp Victory (at Baghdad Airport) Hostile - hostile fire - Rocket attack
US Staff Sergeant Lillian Clamens Camp Victory (at Baghdad Airport) Hostile - hostile fire - Rocket attack
US Sergeant Jason M. Lantieri Iskandariyah - Babil Non-hostile -vehicle accident
US NAME NOT RELEASED YET Baghdad Non-hostile

--------

This has to be one of the most resilient insurgencies that we've ever encountered. Despite heavy losses in men and equipment, the guerrillas return even stronger....ready to launch their own offensive campaigns.

However, our tactics tend to play into their hands. It was sad to see another 15 innocent women and children perish the other day. This new kind of war being fought in and around the neighborhoods is proving to be enormously destructive. Massive airstrikes and attacks by helicopter gunships is causing heavy civilian casualties and widespread damage.

It would be much wiser to extricate ourselves now from Iraq than continue these kinds of useless operations. It really is throwing 190 BILLION dollars down the toilet....to one of the most corrupt countries in the world.

WOW, it must be real, it made it to CNN!

October 12, 2007
DiCaprio, Clooney to team up for Dean movie

Leonardo DiCaprio is in talks to star in a film loosely based on Howard Dean.

WASHINGTON (CNN) — Howard Dean didn't make it to the White House, but could some form of him make it to the big screen?

According to the Hollywood Reporter, stars Leonardo DiCaprio and George Clooney are in discussions to join forces for a movie loosely based on the former governor's meteoric rise and fall in the 2004 Democratic presidential primaries.

The move is set to be adapted from an upcoming Broadway play by Beau Willimon. The play, "Farragut North," tracks a novice but inspired campaign staffer who works for an "unorthodox" presidential candidate, according to the newspaper. Willimon worked on Dean’s presidential campaign.

The Hollywood Reporter writes that, according to the talks, Clooney would direct and produce the adaptation, and DiCaprio would star and produce.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/

So Sanchez and the others were *just following orders.* Sounds horribly familiar.

This in my inbox.

As you may remember, before Congress left for the August recess, it caved into the overreaching demands by the Administration and passed the so-called Protect America Act.  This legislation weakened the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) and failed to adequately protect the rights of Americans at home and abroad - giving the government free reign to eavesdrop on law-abiding Americans, all without meaningful oversight.

We all understand that we must aggressively seek out suspected terrorists, and we can do that without sacrificing our rights and freedoms.

In the coming days, Congress will have the opportunity to fix this problem.  We must amend this legislation to provide meaningful judicial and congressional oversight for this program.  I need your help today to make sure that Congress doesn’t give in to the scare tactics of the Bush administration. Please take a moment and write your Representative and urge them to protect our rights.

Write Your Representative: Protect Our Rights!

When you email a friend living abroad or call your son or daughter studying in a foreign country, you should be able to do so while enjoying the same rights and freedoms you would if the call was to a neighbor down the street.  In the aftermath of the warrantless wiretapping scandal, it is unthinkable that this President would advocate for a surveillance program devoid of meaningful judicial oversight.

Let me emphasize that these reckless changes were made with the support of both Democrats and Republicans in Congress. The decision to give this President these powers, given his history of complete disregard for the rights of law-abiding Americans, was irresponsible.  Congress must not be intimidated into giving this President, or any President, overly broad discretion when it comes to the surveillance of Americans.

Write Your Representative: Protect Our Rights!

Congress can and must produce a bill that provides the tools needed to pursue suspected terrorists aggressively, while also protecting the rights and freedoms of law-abiding Americans.

Thank you for your immediate help in addressing this alarming situation.

Sincerely,

Russ Feingold
United States Senator
Honorary Chair, Progressive Patriots Fund

Another movie coming out is "Rendition."  Several others dealing with Iraq also are on the docket and it looks like Hollywood is taking some serious action.

I wonder how much longer the world is going to let the U.S. push it around.

Please, Al, run.

Skies to be swept for alien life Mexico City evicts 15,000 tradersA telescope array specifically designed to search the skies for signs of alien life is switched on in California. Thousands of street vendors are removed from the historic centre of Mexico City by hundreds of riot police.

Hmm, that didn't go well, did it?

The vaccine is designed to enhance the body's own immune response to the cancer, said the Roswell Park Cancer Institute, based in Buffalo, New York.

Most patients with advanced disease respond to chemotherapy, but more than 70% die from a recurrence of the cancer within five years of diagnosis.

Cancer Research UK welcomed the study but said further trials were needed.

Details of the study appear in Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences.

We are confident that the vaccine will eventually be widely available
Professor Kunle Odunsi

The vaccine contains an ovarian cancer protein fragment coupled with a molecule known to induce immune response.

It targets a protein produced in a high proportion of ovarian cancer cells, but not in healthy cells.

The researchers tested it in women with epithelial ovarian cancer, a cancer type that originates in the covering of the ovaries.

They said although their study was designed as a phase one clinical trial - a preliminary study - it had produced "encouraging" results.

Dual effect

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/7042410.stm 

R&R time.  CU tomorrow.

Phil Specht

I challenge all of you to come up with a fairer system than one that treats every voter equally like I propose.

OK. Everybody votes on the same day. Whoever gets the most votes is the nominee. 100% pure, undiluted, unmanipulated, democracy. Doesn't get "equaler" than that.

190. seashell :-)
=================

That would be monumental. To enhance the immune system. I have always thought of cancer as an immune system disorder, and carcinogenic chemicals as immune system disruptors.

Chemo is different. From what I've heard, it destroys the immune system. When it becomes intolerable to use, the victim is behind the 8 ball.

finger prints left aside
the one's to question always hide
charge a million
there's a billion to give
yank a rope
tell a lie
look directly
into their eyes
bring atrophy
to bear
in our minds
state your proposition
line by line
no one can read it
its legalese in time
none counting
but all in line
the next to buy
salivates at the try
trees hang over
shady daze ahead
if not for tomorrow
at least for our kin.

i highly recommend joni mitchell's new record "shine." listening now...

Good morning, BFA ... just passing through to say goodbye to Tom again! Farewell!

*************
volney simmons: I like and agree with all your points about Al. If not in 2008, never, methinks. We may not have a country left after 2008 if we don't win then. While I believe that we have a host of Dem good candidates, there is none, IMHO, like Al. Like some others here, I believe that a President Dodd would work the best with Al with a shared vision of the world and Dodd's ego, unlike that of some others, would not get in the way of mutual cooperation and support, but so far Dodd is still polling in the lower tiers. There are others who might also work, but I'd rather have the *real thing.*

So I am keeping my fingers very crossed. :-)

*************
sea: glad to hear that you're feeling better. Hope that the acupuncture worked wonders so that you can go dancing.

You might want to try riding sidesaddle if the groin isn't up to the *spread* when you go to the estancia. ;-)

**************
Phil: I like your idea of one primary season to occur at the same time over a several-day period. It seems so reasonable, one wonders just why it hasn't been adopted.

Ah, perhaps because there is lots of big money involved in the various state-wide campaigns and we have a whole slew of hangers-on with expensive careers as political operatives. If you ask me, it is these last in particular who have distorted politics and our perceptions of the candidates. It is people like you, i.e., all those tireless people at the state and local levels, most of whom receive no salary at all for their dedicated efforts, who represent the purest form of democracy.

I am not naive enough to believe that no realistic candidate can mount a campaign without paid staffers and organizers. But it is the high-priced individuals, *consultants* like Trippi, Carville and their ilk, whom I mean by *political operatives.* They are *hired guns* who often cynically manipulate those who believe in them.

Sorry if I have offended any true believers in Trippi, but after he expended all the money that we had contributed for Howard for his own ad company (if the ads had been good, that would have been one thing, but they were terrible), tried to turn a candidate of substance into a gimmick, didn't come back at the MSM at once on their making Howard's infamous scream into something that it wasn't ... and then left the campaign at a most vulnerable moment ... I lost respect for him. I felt that he really believed that Howard's campaign had become more about him than about Howard. Just MO. But that was it for me.

Anyway, must figuratively saddle up and get on my merry way. I'll bbl with some headlines, hopefully in time for the new thread.

Hey, mprov! Waves

Now gone.

Good morning, everybody

Opera not accepting comments this morning.  But, it's easy to refresh on firefox since the thread hasn't changed.  Guess they want to make sure at HQ that we all know that Tom Hughes is leaving.

Got a message last night that one of our group was in a serious car accident, totally wrecking their vehicle, because some young woman was fixing her radio and didn't notice that she'd drifted over into on-coming traffic.  Guess everyone was buckled in because nobody was seriously hurt. 

What this narrow escape from injury or death reminded me of is that the human body is really very fragile and any one of us can be GONE just like that, in an instant of inattention or a blood clot in the wrong spot. or even a few hours of being six degrees too hot or too cold.  And that's why we set up social organizations--not to protect the individual, but to carry on the work of the group.  Not only is none of us indispensible, a sign of a good and viable organization is that individuals can be dispensed with without making a significant difference.  It's not good to be dependent on leaders whose removal would cause the organization to collapse.  And, it's a mistake to think that by removing a leader, the organization can be collapsed.  That was the big mistake in Iraq; thinking that removing Saddam Hussein would make the Iraqis  putty in U.S. hands.

It's also, btw, a mistake that's being made by our Democratic leadership in the House and Senate.  In a sense.  Nancy Pelosi seems to have concluded that she's indispensible and that's making her ineffective.  She's putting so much effort into staying the leader, she's not looking where she's going. 

187.  The Times report on the talks suggested that Condi was angry at being lectured by Putin for 48 minutes, but Gates took it with equanimity.  No doubt that's because Gates recognizes that if Russia planted missiles, say in Panama, we'd be more than irked.  Besides, the Pentagon has doubtless concluded that putting a version of the N.S.A, with it's attendant radar installations and satellite down-load facilities is an unrealistic project for Iraq.  It seems they're not even able to bring all the supplies for the bases in by plane (as evidenced by worries that Turkey will cancel off-loading, transit and transport rights) even with planes landing and taking off at Balad every five minutes 'round the clock.  So, if the locals remain hostile, the bases cannot be properly supplied.

It isn't just the surveillance of Americans that must be restricted.  There's no reason why foreigners shouldn't be accorded the same protection for their human rights--including the right to privacy.

178.  I should note for the record that, according to our Secretary of State, originally it wasn't NH's idea to hold the first primary.  It just sort of happened because our town meetings for local elections are held in the first week of March, I think, and the presidential was sort of folded in.  Then, I guess, NH proved a convenient venue for candidates and citizens who don't have much else to keep them busy during the winter months and people started agitating to keep the significance that being early/first provided.

There's actually something peculiar about winters in New Hampshire.  Though it gets cold and there's often lots of snow, since it's not as big as Maine and not as mountainous as Vermont, it's still possible to get around in between the major weather events.  Also, the seacoast climate is somewhat milder because of the ocean temperatures.  Add to that that, for some reason, New Hampshire gets a lot of winter sun when it's not actually snowing.  So, not only are we used to early plowing, but the stuff tends to melt at a good clip.  Finally, NH sits above the snow belt that sweeps across the Great Lakes, central NY and MA and leaves them snow-bound much more often.  So, NH is sort of a winter play-ground because normal outdoor activities come to a halt (no building, no planting, nothing growing, etc).

Some people come to NH to ski.  Others come to politik.  LOL

There's nothing to keep tourists from taking part in both. 

Monica Smith
Sat, 10/13/07
6:06 am
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Wow!  That was quite some list of places you have moved to and from.......

LZ XRAY
Fri, 10/12/07
11:17 pm
___________________________________________________________________________

They are Arab bedoiun fighters.........some of the toughest people in the world, under the harshest of conditions, but they are bred for deserrt guerilla warfare.............

Remember, what  i said in the beginning? The Western so called coalition would achieve a resounding advance virtually unopposed at the beginning......the iaqi forces would scatter, hide, blend i with the locals or flee to neighbouring counties, and live to fight another day..........

http://www.blogforamerica.com/view/22572

202.

I left out that I was born in Germany and lived in the Austrian Alps during the war.  LOL 

205.  Oh, yes, and nine months in Chile.  Those foreign residencies didn't seem significant to the topic of having an awareness of what America is about.

What is perhaps relevant is that I wasn't part of some social cohort like the military or a "corporate family."  We've lived off the land, so to speak, generally on the margins of impoverished populations or the working class.  Which perhaps explains why some of my reactions to national events are outside the norm--why, for example, I was enthused and felt vindicated when Watts went up in flames and the shops of cheating merchants were torched and why the destruction of the towers in New York seemed just retribution for all the people who were displaced by their erection and deprived of the services the money spent on this boondoggle could have paid for.  The towers were a monument to the hubris of a certain class of men and an eyesore on the Manhattan sky line. 

OK. Everybody votes on the same day. Whoever gets the most votes is the nominee. 100% pure, undiluted, unmanipulated, democracy. Doesn't get "equaler" than that.'

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Who decides the names on the ballot? Who gets to vote in the primary?Is it an IRV ballot? Don't we need public financing first? How is the Platform adopted? Doesn't the Electoral Colllege need to be gone first?

questions my plan addresses

I could see the need for a runoff election like they do in France with the Sitka Plan.

giving up Conventions is no small step, and the practical effect is to blur regional differences necessarily recognized for good governance, but if the General Election was by popular vote, also, would make a great deal of sense

it is a wonder that Clarence Thomas wasn't part of a race riot somewhere, what with his anger, not unlike those that torched Detroit (which still have areas suffering from that)

Monica I understand where you are coming from but it is a perpetuation of the injustice not a cure to be sympathetic of those who rise up in anger

anger doesn't get much built, and it sure isn't healthy

mprov

thanks for making this thread official , your poem or joni mitchell's?

Good letter in this morning's NYT:

Perhaps as Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton more blatantly straddles issues — such as giving the president authority to attack Iran or not — more supporters will begin to see that there is not a lot of there there.

Her potential supporters may begin to ask: Where, exactly, is her experience? What, exactly, are her accomplishments? Her principles? What is her stand on Social Security? On Iran? On Iraq? How long has she held her positions?

Perhaps those supporters will begin to see that the there with Hillary Clinton is Bill Clinton, the elephant in the room that few supporters will acknowledge is the only reason for her success.

The natural progression of such an examination of Hillary Clinton’s credentials will indeed be an examination of the conscience and motivation of each potential voter who undertakes it — an examination that should also involve a review of the duties of an informed citizen within a functional democracy.

BOB HERBERT ON WHY AL (PROBABLY) WON'T RUN

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/13/opinion/13herbert.html?ref=opinion

Al Gore is a serious man confronted by a political system that is not open to a serious exploration of important, complex issues. He knows it.

“What politics has become,” he said, with a laugh and a tinge of regret, “requires a level of tolerance for triviality and artifice and nonsense that I have found in short supply.”

I am not afraid of Hillary Clinton.

I have closed the door on  only one  candidate in the Dem field for POTUS 

Rep Kucinich

Why?

A:  Kucinich's stand on lowering the voting age to 16 was the defining moment for me. 

Note:   I probably would not have rejected any candidate, so early before the Primaries, but this and a *Dept of Peace* are not viable positions.

Thread is screwed up on Firefox and won't allow comments in rich Opera.

Oh well.

I don't know, Phil. A righteous anger can be quite healthy. Even Jesus drove the money-changers out of the temple. One can have understanding and even a visceral reaction of sympathy without actually engaging in destruction. On the other hand, the destruction wrought by "benign neglect" of all municipal services and social obligations strikes me as much more damaging to the psyche than a sudden catastrophe.
What's being done to the physical infrastructure of Iraq is just another example of torture. The goal is to wear the people down until the occupiers gain compliance.

I have two grey boxes covering posts 211 to 214 partially in Firefox plain text. Why?

good morning, folks.  Nor am I  afraid of Hillary Clinton.  Neither is Congressman John Lewis, apparently:

Hillary Rodham Clinton won the endorsement Friday of Rep. John Lewis, a hero of the civil rights struggle, in a blow to Barack Obama in the battle for black support for the Democratic presidential nomination.

"Without reservation or any hesitation I am proud to endorse Hillary Clinton to be the next Democratic nominee to be president of the United States," Lewis said at an appearance with Clinton at Paschal's Restaurant, an Atlanta landmark of the civil rights movement.

The New York senator called the Georgia congressman one of the people she admires most in the world.

"I see my campaign as a continuation of John Lewis' life work," the New York senator said.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071013/ap_on_el_pr/clinton_endorsement;_ylt=ArmOu0ZmpRZPjbk5lt3DmOus0NUE 

"I see my campaign as a continuation of John Lewis' life work," the New York senator said.

gaaag!

149. Linda*in*SFNM

I used to read sirota every day and agreed with just about everything. But that Brown/Hackett smear exposed him as a hack and I haven't been back since. Now he's doing it to Gore in favor of Edwards? Doesn't surprise me a bit. 

+++

David Sirota is a equal opportunity basher.  He's bashed Obama numerous times.  Now Sirota has turned his guns on Gore.

Sad.

I too would count John Lewis as one of the ten people I admire most in the world.

Guess I have something in common with Hillary:) 

216

cChalfonte -

John Lewis didn't have the courage to vote for Jesse jackson when the latter was running for President.  SDtill, Jackson ended up with 90 % of the African American vote.

IMO Lewis, irregardless of his civit rights work, is still living in the past, pre-Rosa Parks days (he still looks up at whites).  Younger GA reps like Sanford Bishop have the courage to endorse Obama.

Ditto

I am not afraid of Hillary Clinton --

-- and I'm not going to vote for her.

214.  Have to agree.....no common sense nor practical sense in 16-year olds voting or a Dept. of Peace.

========================

Al Gore is among my top 10 admired people as well, but as I've said before here, I don't think heis running for president. 

#1, he said he isn't and for the reasons that Rich Kolker and Bob Herbert expressed.

I think we'll cheer on and contribute to his projects and work for decades to come but I don't think he'll hold public office again. 

rdorgan wrote "David Sirota is a equal opportunity basher.  He's bashed Obama numerous times.  Now Sirota has turned his guns on Gore."

This isn't a new phenomenon.  When Josh Frank was found to have jammed Sen. Obama with one of his political broadsides, he was heralded here as an gifted analyst with rare insight.  When he it was pointed out that he had similarly turned his guns on Vice President Gore and Gov. Dean, he was vilified the way you would expect such an ill informed churl would be.

kudos to the Red Sox for last night's win

bbl (off to do some yard work)

221.  To accuse John Lewis of lacking courage, and particularly to accuse him of "looking up to whites", indicates clearly, that you no little of his life's work.

rdorgan, people are passionate about their candidates.......certainly you are about Obama.  Please note that that passion can sometimes cloud your better judgment.  Your constant Hillary-bashing surprises me.  You do more of that than bringing the strengths of your own candidate to the blog lately.

Please think about that. 

Jesse Jackson:

I have never, nor would I vote for Jesse, although I like him very very much.

*r, please don't beat on John Lewis.  I take your negatives on John Lewis just now are reflective of your passion for Barack.  Barack is good, even as John Lewis endorses another candidate.

rdorgan wrote "IMO Lewis, irregardless of his civit rights work, is still living in the past, . . ."

I suspect he was promised a future political favor and accepted it.  He's just playing the odds at this point.

225.

Good thinkin' Lincoln.

Imn2 wrote "I have never, nor would I vote for Jesse, although I like him very very much."

Well we're not alike in that regard.  I voted for Jackson in the 1988 Michigan primary, which he won by the way, but it was an open primary and probably not indicative of the preference of a majority of Michigan Democrats.

"no little" s/b know little, of course.

IRAQ is FUBAR

Our Dept of Defense and State are FUBAR

In fact, Republican party led government is FUBAR 

bbl (off to do some yard work)++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Be sure and mow aound the rusted out abandoned school bus in the back.........think of the neighbours

I left out that I was born in Germany and lived in the Austrian Alps during the war.  LOL 

___________________________________________________________________________

Monica,

You werent in The Sound of Music were you?

I admire Jesse Jackson and can understand the will to, as some might see it, throw ones vote away. 

BTW  I don't think it's a "throw away" vote.

TTFN 

"Barack is good, even as John Lewis endorses another candidate."

Exactly.  I'd be proud of the country if we elected a President Barak Obama.  His platform is very progressive.

 Like Kucinich, Jesse Jackson is a good man....just not presidential material, imo.

Mike wrote "Be sure and mow aound the rusted out abandoned school bus in the back."

Make sure to trim around the lawn jockey you have out near the gate in front of your community.

A CANADIAN VIEW OF AL'S NOBEL

(long, but a gem)

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20071012.cosimp13/BNStory/specialComment/home

If the world could vote, Al Gore would be the next president of the United States.

He is the most qualified American to be president of the world's most important country: congressman, senator, vice-president, statesman, policy expert, communicator, winner of an Oscar, an Emmy and, now, the Nobel Peace Prize. No candidate, not even Hillary Clinton, can match those credentials.

The next president's stiffest challenge will be to repair the international damage done to the reputation of the United States by the Bush administration. Putting Mr. Gore in the White House would repair some of the damage almost overnight; the rest will take a long time to fix, given the extent of the damage.

Presidents need great judgment on matters of high state. On the two most important issues of our time, Mr. Gore was profoundly right, whereas the Bush administration was utterly wrong.

Mr. Gore opposed the invasion of Iraq, predicting with the wisdom of experience just how calamitous that decision would be. And, of course, he became a kind of conscience for the world in drawing attention to the global challenge of climate change. For this, he won the Nobel Prize.

Just think what the international scene would be like had Mr. Gore not been jobbed out of the presidency by the crazy, anachronistic Electoral College and the political machinations of the U.S. Supreme Court.

There would have been no invasion of Iraq; no expansion of Iran's influence through Iraq, Lebanon and the Shia communities of Bahrain and Saudi Arabia; no “axis of evil” fantasy; no millions of Iraqi refugees; no thousands and thousands of casualties; no hundreds and hundreds of billions of dollars spent. And no need, therefore, to look for an exit strategy from defeat.

On climate change, the United States would have been a leader rather than an obstacle. Yes, President Gore would have struggled to get legislation past a recalcitrant Congress. But he would have tried and tried, and he would have had the bully pulpit of the presidency at his disposal.

It is, of course, to fantasize about what might have been, just as it is to imagine that Mr. Gore might yet be persuaded to seek the Democratic Party nomination.

The powers that be in the party are largely Clintonite now. Hillary, the great triangulator, has the nomination in the bag, assuming her husband behaves himself. She is far too shrewd and programmed to make a whopping mistake that would alienate enough of the party to deny her the nomination.

She has positioned herself, courtesy of this instinct for triangulation, to appeal to most of the constituent groups in the party. She has mastered the policy briefs. And, of course, she can count on Bill's popularity, which eclipses her own.

Were a Gore candidacy possible, she and the Clintonites would walk barefoot across a field of broken glass to prevent it and, if that were not possible, to defeat him.

The presidency is the prize for which Hillary and Bill have longed since he left office. They remember angrily how Mr. Gore foolishly treated Mr. Clinton in the 2000 election, putting far too much distance between himself and Mr. Clinton, and refusing to allow the president to campaign for the Democratic ticket in his own state of Arkansas.

Had Mr. Gore run a better campaign, there would never have been the farce of the hanging chads, the Justices Scalia/Thomas/Rehnquist gyrations on the Supreme Court, and the rest of the Third World machinations that attended George W. Bush's ascension to the presidency. Mr. Gore could never seem in that presidential marathon to decide just who he was, or at least how he wished to position himself as candidate and possible president.

It seems to have taken defeat for Mr. Gore to sort out those answers, an internal exercise that has given him a moral clarity that now defines his public persona. He would not be the first for whom defeat has been cathartic, but the memory of how that defeat unfolded, and his decisive role in it, still stirs resentment in many Democratic Party regulars.

Nonetheless, petitions are signed, and newspaper advertisements are funded, and bloggers press their case that Mr. Gore should enter the race and save the party from the triangulator, and the country from the Republicans.

Mr. Gore would have instant access to millions of dollars to pay the entry card for presidential poker. He would not lack in the primaries for legions of the dedicated. But the hour is late, very late – the Democrats (like the Republicans) have advanced their primaries so that, in all probability, the presidential candidates will be known by early February.

Drafts never work in politics, as Mr. Gore must know. If he enters, he must do so fast and hard, with no guarantee of success, given the Clintonites' grip.

Why, Mr. Gore will surely ask, does he need the lacerations of electoral politics again, and submit to the drivel that passes for so much media coverage (the kind he deplored in his latest book, The Assault on Reason), when his standing has now been further elevated by the Nobel Prize?

John wrote "A CANADIAN VIEW OF AL'S NOBEL"

I give those Canadians credit.

Paul Sakuma / Associated PressSarah Allen of Nashville makes her views plain outside Al

Oops - caption cutoff.  Should say "outside Al Gore's press conference Friday."

Tom Bearse
Sat, 10/13/07
10:29 am
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Actually, because of the drought, there is not much grass left, in fact it resembles al anbar........but I DO fly my Carolina Hurricane flag proudly from the front porch bannister..........

The towers were a monument to the hubris of a certain class of men and an eyesore on the Manhattan sky line. 

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

perhaps Monica, but inside those buildings were human beings.......regardless of class, race, gender or religion there were fellow beings like ourselves..their only crime is they got up, had breakfast and went to work that day..............

Good morning Borg I guess Sheri wants to keep the post about Tom up as long as possible.

I agree with Judy about Trippi and with Monica about something but I can't remember what it was.

I was thinking this morning we should impeach Pelosi. I don't know if you can do such a thing. I know she 'doesn't have enuf votes' the constant excuse, but there are lots of things she can do like keep bills off the floor. But she is not pushing the progressive cause and I know she is one b/c she's from SF. Worst of all she's letting things get through that go against the grain of what is America - like that FISA bill.
So, IMPEACH PELOSI.

The LBJ library broadcast last night was pretty good. I feel like I'm getting a painless course in US history by watching these. It made me realize what monumental things LBJ accomplished like Medicare and the Civil Rights law. I doubt if anyone else could have gotten some of the stuff through Congress.

Apparently there is a FRONTLINE on Tuesday, 9 PM, ET, PBS, called CHENEY'S LAW. Just guessing here, but I doubt if it will be kind.

The other thing I was thinking based on something I saw on TV last night was that the US will probably (and maybe sooner that we would care to think) just implode like Russia did -- in E Germany one day they were E Germany, next day they weren't -- the Gov't had no money. Sound familiar?

Just one more thought, the think about Al Gore and the current Dem candidates is -- if you look at the current field of candidates they look OK, anyone would be OK. But if you stand Al Gore up next to say Hill, Obama, and Edwards, our front runners, there is simply no comparison. Al Gore would be in technicolor, all the rest in black and white. Maybe the country would see that too.

Mike wrote "Actually, because of the drought, there is not much grass left, in fact it resembles al anbar........but I DO fly my Carolina Hurricane flag proudly from the front porch bannister.........."

That's a good look.  Coincidentally, I have my U of M flag flying on the front of the house this morning.  It goes up on most Saturdays from September  to December.  It was a gift, very graciously given to me by my sister-in-law who graduated from Michigan State.

PESTICDE ACTION NETWORK - SIGN THE PETITION

On October 5, EPA approved a new fumigant pesticide -- the carcinogenic chemical methyl iodide -- ignoring concerns of over fifty eminent scientists about the risks workers and communities will face if this chemical is used.

Arysta Life Sciences, the Japanese manufacturer, has announced plans to market methyl iodide globally as a replacement for the ozone depleting methyl bromide, slated for international phase-out under the Montreal Protocol treaty.

In a letter to EPA Administrator Stephen Johnson on September 25, the nation's leading chemists asked EPA not to approve methyl iodide without further scientific review. The chemical has been used to induce cancer in laboratory experiments and causes neurological and thyroid problems, as well as miscarriages in studies with laboratory animals.

Tell EPA Administrator Stephen Johnson to immediately reverse EPA's approval of methyl iodide: don't replace one dangerous chemical with another.

http://action.panna.org/petition.jsp?pet...

Just talked to Thankful, just about at Painesville, Ohio, LOL! She wanted me to tell Paine that she's sorry she missed dropping in for lunch this week (was full of driver's licenses, car insurance, new car, packing . . . ) and she'll catch him when she gets back. ♥

Annilow wrote "But if you stand Al Gore up next to say Hill, Obama, and Edwards, our front runners, there is simply no comparison."

I had every intention of supporting Gore in 2004 until he announced he was not a candidate.  I would have said the same thing about Howard Dean as you have about the current candidates, in comparison to Gore before Dean's campaign began, but I think I was wrong.

puddle wrote "[Thankful] wanted me to tell Paine that she's sorry she missed dropping in for lunch this week (was full of driver's licenses, car insurance, new car, packing . . . )"

Oh sure.  I think she's consciously avoiding him.

Fred I signed the petition.

New Evidence That Blackwater Guards Took No Fire

When asked if anything had occurred to provoke the initial shots from Blackwater, Sabah said: “Nothing at all. No mortars. No shooting.”

All he saw, Sabah said, was that the white sedan “moved a little bit and they started shooting.”

As events unfolded and the Blackwater guards unleashed a storm of gunfire into the crowded square, Mr. Waso and Mr. Ali both said, they could neither hear nor see any return fire. “It was one-sided shooting from one direction,” Mr. Waso said. “There wasn’t any return fire.”

Mr. Waso said that what he saw was not only disturbing, but also in some cases incomprehensible. He said that the guards kept firing long after it was clear that there was no resistance. People were shot while trying to flee, he said. One man ran from a Volkswagen and the guards shot him in the head from behind, Mr. Waso said.

Finally there was a pause of a few seconds in the shooting as the Blackwater convoy prepared to leave, he said. Then, Mr. Waso said with a look of disbelief on his face, at least one Blackwater guard began firing again, this time at a red bus full of people on the western rim of the square.

“The glass was all broken,” Mr. Waso said, struggling to describe the bus after the firing resumed. “Women and children, all of them were shouting and crying.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/13/world/...

Besides being terrorists themselves, these Blackwater guards are probably on amphetamines and alcohol.

The blog is crashing Firefox on the linux box. Seems to be happy with Opera.

I just want to point out that our military is relying on computers to direct drones over Iraq and bomb "identified" targets. Somebody needs to ask our representatives who are paying out our dollars for this stuff whether they'd trust a computer to give them their heart medecine every morning.


Totally unrelated--the mailman delivered a letter to our box this morning. It had the right house number, but the street and the town are in NEW ZEALAND!!! The postman tried to tell us it was the computer's fault and the GPS.

Thanks Annilow,

It is remarkable, 46 years after Silent Spring, we are still fighting these battles.

I just called the White House and got a real person. I told her to read the Blackwater Article this morning in the Times "these guys are making Al Qaeda look like Boy Scouts."

The White House is 1-202-456-1414

Whenever I'm puzzled at things like the lack of outrage among Americans about the actions and even the presence of mercenaries like Blackwater, I remind myself that the other side simply paints a completely separate reality.....Americans then choose which reality to believe.

What we KNOW that Blackwater is doing is heinous enough.  No need to overstep and throw out accusations of alcoholism and drug abuse among them....we have no evidence of that.  On the other hand we have a plethora of evidence of their activities that are tantamount to war crimes. 

Thanks Tom for all that you do. Good luck to you, and be sure to keep on doing.

The Man Who Won as Others Lost

Paul Tudor Jones II, one of Wall Street’s most fabled financial speculators, predicted the 1987 market crash...

leans back in his chair and grins. The stock market is going to crash, and he knows it. “There will be some type of a decline, without a question, in the next 10, 20 months,” he says in his rich Memphis drawl. “And it will be earth-shaking; it will be saber-rattling.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/13/busine...

243.

Right. And if the alarm systems had been working properly, the buildings would have been evacuated and fewer would have been killed. And if there had been social justice in the first place, those buildings would never have been built and sucked the life-blood out of the commercial sector of lower Manhattan.

Meanwhile, over a million Iraqis have been bombed, shot and incinerated because the head of their government refused to grant basing rights to the U.S.and our governmental agents continue to perpetrate the myth that those deaths are in retaliation for the attacks on the towers.

Why exactly is the death of a person more significant when it was perpetrated on purpose but not authorized than when it is perpetrated accidentally by an authorized action? Is it because when people are following orders from a "legitimate" entity the moral value of the act is enhanced?

256. *** cChalfonte***

Whenever I'm puzzled at things like the lack of outrage among Americans about the actions...Americans then choose which reality to believe.

===========
Caught a few minutes of Charlie Rose as I brushed my teeth last night. They had the head of Blackwater trying to convince the audience that his guys must have had a reason, but accidents happen. Yea, right?

The official word in the second WTC tower, after the first plane hit, was that "all was well, remain calm, no need to leave the building" No wonder conspiracy theories persist. Pure stupidity.

Monica, I'm seeing gray blocks too.

Well, well, well.  I just watched the fair and balanced report of Amanpour's  "God's Jewish Warriors."  The long section on AIPAC, which was excluded from the US media..at least I didn't see it...told of what non-violent, secular Jews here and in Israel are really up to.  Here are some quotes from suits and ties, businessmen types.

" AIPAC writes the legislation for Congress and raises the money from Jews to lobby."

"Expansionism is about revenge."

"Israel has many enemies." (Jesus, I wonder why)

"God gave us the land." (that's my blood boiler) 

"No politican can be elected if the lobby disapproves."

"If Jews compromise with Palestinians, this is the definition of evil."

"AIPAC has the best interest of America and Israel at heart; peace, and no terrorism and this is the justification of our involvement in American politics." (that was paraphrase) 

There was a shot of a huge AIPAC convention with hugging and kissing all around and guess who was in the middle of it?  Yep, Pelosi and Reid. 

The second part of her report was pretty much what was shown in the states...assassination of Rabin, the tearing down of 9 settlement houses, the terrible fight of radical Jews against Israeli soldiers, the crazy Zionists...but it also included the horrible plight of the Palestinians, the theft of their land, the building of the wall, again detrimental to Palestinians who have to go to work.

There are no *he said, she said* sides to this story.  The version here presented the facts unemotionally.  In the states the cleaned up version omitted the influence of AIPAC and its cohorts, played up the crazy Zionists and played down the plight of the Palestinians.

Let's face it guys.  Power has won.  Our country is not run by crazy fundies of any religion, but by secular Jews who run our foreign policy and keep the crazies on the hook with the hope of Armeggedon.

Impeachment is out of the question. It would rock the boat of power and AIPAC needs to be sure that any future president is not going to interfer with expansion and will not try to force peace.  The American and Israeli gov'ts are clear about one thing.  Domination of the ME.  And we the people are paying for the settlements, the arms, and the blood of Palestinians is also on our hands. 

Why isn't the American press talking about this?  I'll let you guess.

Most Israeli Jews loved Rabin and want peace.  The Americans destest bush and want peace.

Hillary will not change foreign policy.  We need to get rid of the Clintons..somehow and soon.  And the Israelis need to get rid of Olmert and soon.  Condi has royally pi$$ed off Putin and I don't blame him.  IMO the pressure cooker is about ready to explode and I don't know how to prevent it.  Elections are too far away since putzco still has plenty of time to bomb Iran and god only knows what Israel is planning with Syria, if anything.

Pelosi was our hope and she's a turncoat and bought off.

Gore...it comes down to Al Gore, unless IA and NH wise up and reject Clinton and embrace Dodd.

Is it too late to throw out the caucuses and primaries the way they are and have IRV? Look how fast bushie is getting what he wants from Congress (AIPAC) 

Whoever controls the media controls perception and likely the choosing of the president and then the president afterwards. 

Please pass the bananas. 

From Fred's article:

 Except that the crash to which Mr. Jones refers occurred Oct. 19, 1987. His prognostication — brazen, and as impudent as the man himself — was made in a documentary called “Trader,” which was filmed in the year preceding that day.

 More from Fred's NYT article re Tudor Jones:

As for his view on the market [today], Mr. Jones declined to comment for this article. Over the last 17 years, he has rarely publicly expressed an opinion about stocks, bonds or currencies — a reflection of his influence as a trader.

This summer, his funds were hit by the credit crisis and lost 5 percent in August. Through September, Mr. Jones is barely ahead, up 2.5 percent, and he could end up having his worst year in more than a decade.

“He has had a tough time lately,” said Byron R. Wien, a friend of Mr. Jones and a strategist at Pequot Capital Management, a rival hedge fund. “But he is a talent. You go through cold periods, but you don’t lose it.”

Fred posted the clip implying that Mr. Jones was talking about the market today.  He was not...the quote was from just before the 1987 crash.  Further, Mr. Jones declined to comment on the current article.

Excellent evidence of twisting truth, creating a separate (and false) reality.  

We should be better than that. 

imn2paine,.......

You decided to reject Kucinich because he mentioned lowering the voting age, and he talks of a Dept. of Peace. Those are certainly two terrible things. You didn't mention that he also is not Tall.

Kucinich--

16-year olds are not adults.  I see no evidence that bringing children (the most vulnerable and impressionable of all) into the voting process would improve things

Department of State is the Department of Peace.  That its (State's) current inhabitants are inept doesn't diminish the fact that that is exactly what the Dept. of State is. 

I'm thinking Paine did not mention Dennis K's height because he didn't think it relevant. 

256.

No need to overstep and throw out accusations of alcoholism and drug abuse among them....we have no evidence of that. On the other hand we have a plethora of evidence of their activities that are tantamount to war crimes.
================

Drugs and alcohol come off as an excuse, and there is no excuse. These guys shot to straight to be drunk. I'm thinking amphetamines, but the behavior is blatant and erratic, one has to wonder, how anybody in their right mind representing our way of life could act this way?

263.

*** cChalfonte***
==================
my bad

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Last September, Air Force Secretary Michael Wynne indicated the military would use “nonlethal weapons” against “fellow citizens” before they use them in “a wartime situation.” In other words, the American people are considered little more than guinea pigs, especially dissenting Americans in need of “crowd control.”

Before zapping antiwar demonstrators with an ADS beam—that’s short for “Active Denial System”—the military or police may request they remove glasses, contact lenses, and take coins and keys out of their pockets. “Precautions used to test U.S. military’s microwave weapon ADS for crowd control have raised questions about its safety, says a report,” explains United Press International. “These precautions raise concerns about the ADS in real crowd-control situations, the New Scientist reported… The ADS fires a 95-gigahertz microwave beam, which is supposed to heat skin and to cause pain but no physical damage, the report said. Until now little information about its effects had been released.”

In fact, it took a Freedom of Information Act request filed by a group that campaigns against the use of biological and non-lethal weapons to discover how dangerous the ADS weapon is. It was learned that military “experimenters” conducting tests at the Kirtland Air Force Base in Albuquerque “banned glasses and contact lenses to prevent eye damage to the subjects and in the second and third tests removed any metallic objects such as coins and keys to stop hot spots being created on the skin.”

“How do you ensure that the dose doesn’t cross the threshold for permanent

Ok, so I'm frustrated about Al Lewis endorsing Hillary Clinton over Barack Obama, so that probably led to me stating that Lewis lacks courage (that he's afraid of upsetting the Clinton machine).

I wasn't intending to comment on it at all but when I saw cChalfonte's 216. at 9:44am post this morning about Lewis endorsing Clinton, my frustration came out.

I'll be glad in a way that I''ll be away from America for a month starting Oct 25.  It will get me a break from the U.S. media and all the polls and all the crowning already of Hillary that her win of the democrat primary is inevitable.

And, oh Mike, I have a big back yard but not big enough for an abandoned school bus (but you do have a good memory though of the gated versus non-gated community conversation days ago; appreciate the response).

Last September, Air Force Secretary Michael Wynne indicated the military would use “nonlethal weapons” against “fellow citizens” before they use them in “a wartime situation.” In other words, the American people are considered little more than guinea pigs, especially dissenting Americans in need of “crowd control.”

Before zapping antiwar demonstrators with an ADS beam—that’s short for “Active Denial System”—the military or police may request they remove glasses, contact lenses, and take coins and keys out of their pockets. “Precautions used to test U.S. military’s microwave weapon ADS for crowd control have raised questions about its safety, says a report,” explains United Press International. “These precautions raise concerns about the ADS in real crowd-control situations, the New Scientist reported… The ADS fires a 95-gigahertz microwave beam, which is supposed to heat skin and to cause pain but no physical damage, the report said. Until now little information about its effects had been released.”

In fact, it took a Freedom of Information Act request filed by a group that campaigns

"but the behavior is blatant and erratic, one has to wonder, how anybody in their right mind representing our way of life could act this way?"

The dehumanizing effect of war?  The lack of oversight of a civilian outfit in a war zone, perhaps.  The lack of insight from an administration foolish enough to put them there in the first place....the process of self-selection of those who would choose to go there and be paid for that "work"? 

I have no set explanation for why anyone would choose to shoot innocent people in the back as they are fleeing for their lives. 

Look, the mayhem in Iraq has been orchestrated ever since it became obvious that the plan to establish a semi-permanent U.S. presence was going to be resisted. Initially there was a need to provide a justification to the UN for the continued presence of U.S. forces while the bases were being built and outfitted. After that, it was thought possible to develop a consensus of support on behalf of the U.S. presence as a "protective" force to counter the extra-national insurgents. Unfortunately, most Iraqis know full well that the insurgents are their neighbors who are resisting the occupation. Not to mention that it is well known that it was Alawi and his cohorts who brougth the car bomb to Iraq in an effort to destabilize Saddam's regime.

Given that the CIA introduced the car bomb technology to Iraq, it's impossible to ignore the hypothesis that our special forces might still be responsible for their use now.

Clearly, the neocons are convinced that the sole function of government is to provide protection from assault. It's this conviction, presumably, which leads to the assumption that a government's failure to provide protection will prompt its removal by the governed population. So, what I wonder is how many more times will this scenario have to be proved wrong before they give up on destabilization as a strategy for regime change?

I think we're coming up to another deadline in December when the UN has to decide whether a continued US presence, not supported by leases for the bases and a status of forces agreement, should be approved. I wouldn't be surprised if the effort to get rid of the contractors is being looked at as a prelude to getting rid of the rest. If they can get rid of the contractors, then that would be an indication to the Iraqis that the American people are sincere in not wanting to be a long-term occupation force. One step at a time.

270.  rdorgan, I too am frustrated at the media's obsession with the "horserace". 

272.

cChalfonte -

Agreed.

(and now back to mowing around that yellow abandoned vehicle)

Good day all. I disagree with choosing just anyone because they're giving good speeches now. As elections have consequences, so do records and votes.

OR are we just going to "believe" someone will do good, even though records show differently. We will relive what we just did for these past 8 years.


Showing Us You Don't Have To Be The Opposing Party To Be The Opposition
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/10/13...

262. seashell

Most Israeli Jews loved Rabin and want peace. The Americans destest bush and want peace...

Elections are too far away since putzco still has plenty of time to bomb Iran and god only knows what Israel is planning with Syria, if anything.
==================

What is interesting is that, according to Shlaim, Rabin was never for a two-state solution. He was for an Israeli federation of two States. I guess that means Palestinians having their own West Bank and still being citizens of Israel. Not a partition, but similar to the Plan for Iraq Biden is promoting.

Syria is sending mixed signals about the secret rocket attack by Israel. Some are saying it did not even happen, others say they hit an empty warehouse. Very Strange. Could it just be a propaganda ploy by the West? If it was so secret, why did they even tell us?

Next time you order the exterminator to spread poison around the inside and outside or you living space, ask how come humans regularly kill other living things that they don't like. Because they might scare them or they might bite?

correction

"What is interesting is that, according to Shlaim, Rabin was never for a two-state solution. He was for an Israeli federation of two States"

It might have been three states with Gaza.

Seashell -- There are no *he said, she said* sides to this story. The version here presented the facts unemotionally. In the states the cleaned up version omitted the influence of AIPAC and its cohorts, played up the crazy Zionists and played down the plight of the Palestinians.

=====

I can't tell you how much it infuriates me that our news stories are censored. Which amendment is that One (Freedom of the Press).? Sheesh.

rdorgan, enjoy your respite and when you return I sincerely hope that you'll come back and share some of Obama's vision/platform with us.  So what if you're criticized for that? Courage.

======================================================================= 

Congratulations again to Al Gore for his most deserved Nobel Peace Prize.

and thank you for serving our country and our planet in whatever capacity you choose. 

Peace out, all.

279.

Monica Smith
Sat, 10/13/07
1:07 pm

Good point - I signed the petition but I've had pest service since the day before I occupied my new house -- as far as I know I'm roach free -- just spiders and they are occasional -- can't live in FL w/out A/C and pest service-- and a gun of course :~)

281. Guess I could just shoot the roaches lol

Who decides the names on the ballot?

The people who want to run. 

Who gets to vote in the primary?

Everybody who wants to. 

Is it an IRV ballot?

Yes. 

Don't we need public financing first?

Public financing yes, but not necessarily first. 

How is the Platform adopted?

Same way as now. At the convention. When a candidate is voted for so are delegates supposedly loyal to her or his agenda -- just like now. 

Doesn't the Electoral Colllege need to be gone first?

No.

questions my plan addresses

I just addressed them too. 

I could see the need for a runoff election like they do in France with the Sitka Plan.

Not with IRV. 

giving up Conventions is no small step, and the practical effect is to blur regional differences necessarily recognized for good governance, but if the General Election was by popular vote, also, would make a great deal of sense

Democrats can still have ans waste millions of dollars ontheir convention/infomercial.

Democrats can select their nominee by popular vote without waiting for the general election to be decided that way.

The problem I have with Phil's plan is that it seems cpmplicated and exclusionary while keeping in place the layers of obfuscation between the people and democracy. 

Make it simple, honest, and inclusive. 

Ok, so I'm frustrated about Al Lewis endorsing Hillary Clinton over Barack Obama,

Politicians like to back who think will win. Fortunately for Obama, endorsements mean nothing except to other politicians. 

282. Annilow

=============
You can mix Borax (20 mule team, wash booster) with powdered sugar. It kills them and cheaper than Boric acid. Make your own roach sticky traps too.

never tried the Borax, but I know the Boric acid works pretty well. It is cheaper from chem supply than from drug store.

Chalfont,

Nor did I think "tall" was relevant. nor are the other 2 points relevant when stacked up against all of the huge obstacles we must face.

Can we make our choices just based on the most important in relation to our survival really? Can we let the "tall" issues wait till we get some of the other things sorted out? I don't know. Doesn't look like it.

Feed the roaches outside.  Is it really necessary to kill creatures that we don't like?  We kill life forms with such impunity.  No wonder there's no peace.

Every returning soldier I ever talked with said there's a tremendous amount of alcohol and drug usage.  To think otherwise is quite naive.  My first love came back from Nam completely hooked on drugs and alcohol.

As for firing on innocents,  they prolly don't even have to be drunk or high...after all, those people are just inferior *ragheads.*  They are considered like the roaches Americans kill in their homes.  But let's be honest.  Right next door is a never-ending supply of opium. Our gov't might even be handing it out to our soldiers like candy.  

Many of us saw "The War."  Iraq is prolly worse in comparison since nobody knows who the *enemy* is...maybe that 5 year old girl...Yeah, let's kill her.

Whatever happened last Sunday to Costa Rica? Was it forced to join NAFTA? Or CAFTA?  or CRAPA? 

audrey.nc
Sat, 10/13/07
12:32 pm

<Hey, audrey.  I could add to my reasons why I have decided to exclude Dennis from further consideration that he is vertically challenged and I wouldn't want to see our POTUS propped up on a pedestal so that he/she can appear as the rest of us...(kidding).  I actually like short persons hahaha.

In all sincerity, I am sorry if my decision against Rep Kucinich irks you.  In fact, it is difficult to post, because I know it bums the good and dedicated citizens who support him.  In 2004, the Kucinich volunteers were the BEST I saw.

I  like Dennis.  I hope and trust that his voice will be heard in the House for many moon.

~ ~~~~~~~ ~ ~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~ ~~~

250. Puddleriver  

♥

< I know you are kidding and are know that it was T2T4Dean who was doing this and that til she could jump in the car and drive somewhere.

~~~~~~~~~ ~~~ ~ ~~~~~ ~~~~~~~

Off to lunch  TTFN 

280.

cChalfonte -

Thanks.

Oh, and I see now that I called him Al Lewis, when his name is John Lewis.

Maybe it's my subconscious fear that if Al Gore doesn't get into the race for prez, that he will be sucked into the Clinton machine and relectantly endose Hillary.

tonight's games:

go Red Sox !

go Revs !

Many of us saw "The War."  Iraq is prolly worse in comparison since nobody knows who the *enemy* is...maybe that 5 year old girl...Yeah, let's kill her.

General condemns Iraq 'nightmare'

In a sweeping indictment of the four-year effort in Iraq, the former commander of American forces there called the Bush Administration's handling of the war "incompetent" and said the result is "a nightmare with no end in sight".

Lieutenant-General Ricardo Sanchez, who retired in 2006 after being replaced after the Abu Ghraib prisoner abuse scandal, blamed the Bush Administration for a "catastrophically flawed, unrealistically optimistic war plan".

Iraqis berate US for airstrike that killed civilians

BAGHDAD, Iraq | Iraqis voiced outrage Friday over a U.S. military airstrike that killed an estimated 15 civilians, nine children and six women, one of the highest reported civilian death tolls from an American bombing in months.

The bombing occurred Wednesday evening after U.S. troops raided a suspected leadership meeting of the Sunni insurgent group al-Qaida in Iraq that was taking place south of Lake Tharthar, near the town of Samarra in western Iraq. The U.S. military account of the violence said troops were shot at during the raid and called in an airstrike in self-defense. In addition to the civilians killed, the U.S. military estimated that 19 suspected insurgents died.

“This could have been done through the infantry,” said Ibrahim al-Khamas, a Samarra city council member. “But the American Army prefers the easiest solution, which is the air bombardment.”

The bombing came on the evening before Eid al-Fitr, the religious celebration that concludes the Muslim holy month of Ramadan.

“This airstrike was excessive as usual, which led to the fall of civilians,” Khamas added. “People here are now carrying great hatred against the Americans after the raid. This airstrike turned their Eid to grief.”

Rice Worried by Putin's Broad Powers

Now isn't that a case of the pot calling the kettle black? Bush has usurped more power than any president in history and is still grabbing for more. 

imn2paine.....

I am not irked. I simply feel saddened when anyone decides to like or not like a candidate based on some comparatiely small issue.

I haven't decided yet to support Kucinich, I just know that there is enough info for me to have closed the door on Hillary and Obama

I'm actually thinking of supporting Edwards to try to stop Hillary. Obama has probably gotten the message to cool it, just like Wesley Clark did in '04. Obama looks like the Clark of '08. Job well done now that
edwards is in third. Not an Edwards supporter either, but could live with it.

Folks I'm sorry you cannot live in FL without bug service. We are not talking about a bug here and there - they get into your spices and spaghetti and water for heaven's sake. Admittedly it is much better since the advent of a/c b/c I think it is too cold and dry for them. Another place that is awful (roach wise) is that island paradise, Hawaii -- they grow them really big there. Is BA roachy Seashell?

looks like The Thompson Twins are breaking up --

-- Tommy how could you ? how could do this to Fred ?:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071013/ap_po/giuliani_endorsement;_ylt=ArPGhdem.w4CSXLuyY4N9Lph24cA

Thompson backs one-time rival Giuliani

By BRUCE SMITH, Associated Press Writer Sat Oct 13, 12:55 AM ET

CHARLESTON, S.C. - Tommy Thompson endorsed his one-time GOP presidential rival Rudy Giuliani on Friday

...

This thread now takes a full five minutes to load.

Thompson backs one-time rival Giuliani

But can he deliver his half dozen supporters? 

Howard Dean Congratulates Former Vice President Al Gore on Receiving the Nobel Peace Prize
Sat, 10/13/2007 - 10:02 — admin


WASHINGTON, Oct. 12, 2007 -- Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean issued the following statement congratulating former Vice President Al Gore for receiving the Nobel Peace Prize today for his work concerning global warming:

"I want to congratulate our former Vice President Al Gore for winning the Nobel Peace Prize today. No other person has worked harder or done more to draw much needed attention to the crisis of global climate change, one of the most critical issues facing our planet. Future generations will thank him for his work to save our way of life. But the fight is far from over. His example should motivate each one of us to commit ourselves to doing everything we can in our own lives to save our precious planet."

A Prize for Mr. Gore and Science
One can generate a lot of heartburn thinking about all of the things that would be better about this country and the world if the Supreme Court had done the right thing and ruled for Al Gore instead of George W. Bush in 2000. Mr. Gore certainly hasn’t let his disappointment stop him from putting the time since to very good use.

Yesterday, the Nobel committee celebrated that persistence and awarded the Peace Prize to Mr. Gore and a panel of United Nations scientists for their efforts to raise awareness of the clear and present danger of global warming.

The committee said that the former vice president “is probably the single individual who has done most” to create worldwide understanding of what needs to be done to halt the damage caused by greenhouse gas emissions. It credited the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change for creating “an ever-broader informed consensus about the connection between human activities and global warming.”

What the citation didn’t mention but needs to be said is that it shouldn’t have to be left to a private citizen — even one so well known as Mr. Gore — or a panel of scientists to raise that alarm or prove what is now clearly an undeniable link or champion solutions to a problem that endangers the entire planet.

That should be, and must be the job of governments. And governments — above all the Bush administration — have failed miserably.

There will be skeptics who ask what the Peace Prize has to do with global warming. The committee answered that unhesitatingly with its warning that climate change, if unchecked, could unleash massive migrations, violent competitions for resources and, ultimately, threaten the “security of mankind.”
There will also be those who complain that this prize — like the committee’s earlier awards to Jimmy Carter and the chief United Nations nuclear inspector, Mohamed ElBaradei — is an intentional slap at President Bush. It should be. We only wish that it would finally wake up the president.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/13/opinio...



And as Mr. Gore has said only 2 weeks ago. We need Leadership to make the policy to combat this crisis. As with the other crisis we face.

This is from 4 years ago.........4 years ago.

Freedom & Security: Speech to MoveOn.org
Sunday, November 9, 2003
DAR Constitution Hall, Washington, DC
by Al Gore

...sorry puddle, just the link. :)

http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2003...

And as Mr. Gore has said only 2 weeks ago. We need Leadership to make the policy to combat this crisis.

Sounds like a job for the guy on Superman's pajamas. 

I posted a new thread if you all want to go to.
http://www.blogforamerica.com/view/22576...

304 LOL Yes Indeed! :)

296.
Sorry to disagree, but we lived in Florida for fifteen years without "pest control." When we first moved there, I signed a contract with an outfit that "guaranteed" that their "treatment" would keep the termites out of the house forever. Then it turned out that their "guarantee" was based on the assumption that we would call them back for "retreatment" every year and, if there was termite damage, they would pay for the repair if it didn't cost too much. Needless to say, I cancelled that service and let them know that I intended to hold them to their original contract which did not mention "retreatment." As it turned out, eventually we did have a little termite damage and learned that they are attracted to moisture. If you have even the tiniest plumbing leak, they'll show up. Otherwise termites are quite content to feast on the detritus of leaves, bark and dead trees.
The only real hazard presented by these critters is their apparent appetite for petroleum-based plastic casings of things such as electric wires. They gnaw away the plastic and create a condition for an electrical short and fire. These critters also like to consume plastic garbage bags. You'd think industry would be clever enough to mix something into the plastics to make them unpalatable to roaches and rodents. But, no. Better to manufacture more poisons that may well make people sick.
I once bought a container of herbicide but could never bring myself to use it. I do pull out weeds (plants I don't like where they are) but I realize that this is a selfish act. One interesting thing about plants like dandilions is that even after you rip them from the earth, they go right on maturing on the compost heap and spread their seed after they're already dead. Of course, lots of plants spread their seed after the parent has died off--all of the grasses, for example.

a site for elections coverage

http://www.ncec.org/


lindab, there's an article about virginia...

308.

The only real hazard presented by these critters is their apparent appetite for petroleum-based plastic casings of things such as electric wires. They gnaw away the plastic and create a condition for an electrical short and fire. These critters also like to consume plastic garbage bags. You'd think industry would be clever enough to mix something into the plastics to make them unpalatable to roaches and rodents.

Monica,

I've lived in Florida almost my whole life and never have I ever heard of termites attacking plastics. Roaches and rodents will tear away plastic to get at any food inside, but here too I know of no plastic devouring roaches or rodents. News to me!

Once, near us, a squirrel tore away some covering on power lines in an electrical distribution power station. Needless to say the unknowing squirrley had a very quick death, as did our electric power.

Seems Tom forgot to leave somebody in charge of the blog. The next numbered blog is not due up until 9 AM Monday.

 rdorgan
Sat, 10/13/07
12:49 pm
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

yes, my memory is excellant..for now rd.......odd thing, when you mentioned th abandoned school bus in the back yard.......I was riding my bike the ohter day, out i the country..down a very oretty rural country road with very pretty huses with nice landscaping around each, huge lots, etc..................and on in particular, had......................way in the back, with overgrowth of brush semi hiding it.......an old school bus..................

godspeed, tom!  thanks so much for all your hard work!  come visit here with friends as often as you're able.

310
Sorry, didn't mean to implicate termites in plastic consumption. It's the cockroaches, rats and squirrels that go after that. We redid a house in Georgia where all the plastic had been nibbled at the point where the wires came through studs and rafters. I tried protecting boxes of books from possible flooding by wrapping them in plastic. Cockroaches happily ate through that.

Everyone go gather at the link at 305. This is going to be a LONG weekend.

http://www.blogforamerica.com/view/22576...

OK, so we're moving here. Just keep posting the URL from time to time

316 doesn't work even though it looks the same as 305

The extra dots at the end are the problem in 316
http://www.blogforamerica.com/view/22576...

good gawd they must have partied hard at Tom's going away party

down the rabbit hole to Linda's thread we go ...

I know it's the weekend and all, but a 30+ hour thread with over 300 posts is ridiculous.

And the blog clock keeps getting farther behind. Takes me about 5 seconds to update my computer's clock.

Leonardo DiCaprio is in talks to star in a film loosely based on Howard Dean.

WASHINGTON (CNN) — Howard Dean didn't make it to the White House, but could some form of him make it to the big screen?

According to the Hollywood Reporter, stars Leonardo DiCaprio and George Clooney are in discussions to join forces for a movie loosely based on the former governor's meteoric rise and fall in the 2004 Democratic presidential primaries.

The move is set to be adapted from an upcoming Broadway play by Beau Willimon. The play, "Farragut North," tracks a novice but inspired campaign staffer who works for an "unorthodox" presidential candidate, according to the newspaper. Willimon worked on Dean’s presidential campaign.

The Hollywood Reporter writes that, according to the talks, Clooney would direct and produce the adaptation, and DiCaprio would star and produce.

Dean, now chairman of the Democratic National Committee, led the 2004 Democratic field in both the polls and campaign cash heading into the first wave of primaries. But, after a disappointing third place showing in Iowa, the Vermont Democrat's campaign quickly fizzled out. He ultimately failed to win a single caucus or primary outside of his home state of Vermont.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2007/10/13/dicaprio-clooney-to-team-up-for-dean-movie/

Be careful what you wish for.

The fact that Al's Nobel is being trashed by right wingnuts and associated media comes as no surprise. What did surprise (and appall) me is that so many on the left are criticising the award, and in the vilest of terms:

http://www.counterpunch.org/cockburn10132007.html

http://www.counterpunch.org/hoffman10132007.html

http://www.counterpunch.org/oberg10122007.html

Cant find a link, but apparently Sirota is also making nasty.

sigh..............................

I would expect the Carville cabal to be especially viscious to Al for the next few weeks. Who has the most to lose? Mark Penn? Al Fromm?

Who's Mark Penn ?

3826

Party's moved here:

http://www.blogforamerica.com/view/22576...

299. puddle

This thread now takes a full five minutes to load
===============

Even a dial up shouldn't take that long. Do you have modem that has v.92 standard with v.44 compression? If not, that might be the problem.

They say the old fashioned 9-pin serial is the still the best way to go, although Intel hyperthreading CPUs may need a software patch on the driver for the serial connection, to avoid problems, so I've read. Any major brand of modem should have it by now.

http://www.blogforamerica.com/view/22576...

http://w

George Will just slammed Al Gore on ABC News This Week, stating that a NYT Times article, after Gore winning Nobel Peace Prize, titled "Gore Vindicated", could easily be applied to say an Yassar Arafat being vindicated.

Will said he's against the Nobel Peace Prize system, against Al Gore and against the concept that global warming is really a problem.

I just want to know, how can such a seeming smart guy like Will be so dumb and blindsighted when it comes to Gore ?

What the hell's going on?

I have to agree with Rich Kolker (in spades) that DFA doesn't give a damn about BFA

http://www.blogforamerica.com/view/22576...

Thank YOU, Tom for all you have done!

I wish you the best, and hope to see your mark on the way things are going in this country, even from your place in the private sector.

For all us stepchildren of DFA to move on:

http://www.blogforamerica.com/view/22576

Thank you Tom. Good luck in your future endeavors.

I look forward to Arshad's leadership. A very good choice. 

Would the last person in DFA VT please turn out the lights(?)
... in honor of Al Gore.

The blog is alive and well at

http://www.blogforamerica.com/view/22576...

Hi folks!

My hubby and I had a great weekend. How was yours?

Dangling on the end of a long, long,thread. Just watched Alive Day on HBO. I was doing ok 'til they played "America The Beautiful". We have lost so damned much since that effing fixed election in 2000.

Stand up.......Keep fighting!

Thanks Tom and Good Luck.

T3

fyi - new front thread

I had the pleasure of living with Tom Hughes (and totally screwing up large portions of his weekends by making him suffer through watching crappy Live Earth performances and other pointless TV.) The man is incredible at what he does, has a great work ethic and is genuinely one of the nicest human beings you'll ever meet.

DFA will miss him, and that company that he's moving to has a lot to smile about today. All in all, best of luck to you Tom, you're the best.

 Your favorite intern,

Franco Caliz

P.S. Go Sox

P.P.S.- Thank you for letting me bring sexy back to Vermont.