Dean's progressive values are first and were first in 2004.

I'd like to suggest that what we're moving towards--i.e. progressing to--is human equality.  It's an idea that's meeting with great resistance from people who feel inadequate unless they can subjugate someone else.

2.

Monica Smith
Thu, 10/11/07
4:15 pm



Thank you Monica. Your thought and words are indeed wise.

I want to thank Edwin Rutsch and Joan Kuenz for their courage to live and act upon their dreams. This is an amazing project. It is truly a labor of love. It was an honor for me to be allowed to be a participant.

What a concept? Thank you Susan........lets all progress forward.

Susan

You were one of the very first people I interviewed there in Sacramento!   I was just getting started with the project. So I very much appreciate your enthusiasm and  support on this..

We have a lot of work still to do..  I wanted to get maybe 200 simple interviews to get a story base to work from. We then want to do in-depth interviews where we follow people around and put more image rich stories together.  So the project should go well into next year..  Maybe then start working on value  specific documentaries..  take each progressive  value the has come up (caring, empathy, community, justice, etc.)  and go into depth on it with stories.  

A video about the failure of Conservative Values would be another project idea.

I've been trying to figure out how to interview the Democratic Presidential candidates on Progressive Values. It would be good to get them talking about values and talking about what values unite them as Progressives.  There was something like that at the Sojourners' Presidential Forum on Faith, Values, and Poverty... but I'd like to take the values discussion out the the religious realm.

edwin
progressivespirit.com

Monica

Ormond Otvos talked about that in one of the interviews. 
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Io6fDYO-4tM 
Perhaps I can interview you on that topic of moving forwards in expanding equality some time. .  

I find it interesting to contrast Conservative with Progressive Values.  I think if people could see how they contrast:  hierarchy versus equality, authoritarian versus democratic, etc.  it would help clarify the choices, and I think  people would vote progressive.  We have  to clarify it for people, tell the stories and make the case.

i did this up in sacramento also. wasn't included in the 10 minute version though. susan's in it a little.

OK, so now it's Tuesday, October 16.

I watched the YouTube and Dean's equation of fairness with equality is good, maybe. Fairness is probably not as antagonizing as equality, but there's a certain taint of deservedness in fairness, that equality doesn't contain.

Tough is good, especially if you partner it with resilient and resolute. It is a relative value in that it's exercised in relation to something else. Think of the difference between shredding a tissue and a piece of leather. Tough can take a lot of wear and still bounce back.

"fiscal" is an interesting word in that it doesn't bring any image to mind. To a conservative that wants to do what's right, it might sound like a weasel word. Can't we just say that a fiscal conservative is "cheap." You think that conflicts with "liberal?" But, isn't that the point? We're cheapskates who believe in liberty.

The last thing I'd bring up is that conservatives don't seem to believe in self-control. That's why they keep having to make up all those petty rules, which they don't like and don't enforce and then leave us with a mess.

Which raises an interesting question. How come we have so many people who lack self-control? I think there are two causes: over-restrictive rearing and overly permissive rearing. One produces people who fear punishment, if they act on their own; the other produces people who fear failure, if they act on their own.

People Power!

A New Hampshire Write-In for Gore Can Win (Brent Budowsky)
@ 3:41 pm

Note: The following is an elaboration on an op-ed to be published in The Hill’s edition of Tuesday, Oct. 16.
It is undoubtedly a long shot, but the voters of New Hampshire have a wonderful history of confounding the experts and changing the course of American history.

Dwight Eisenhower was enlisted in 1952 by voters in New Hampshire. Henry Cabot Lodge in 1964 won a pure New Hampshire write-in while serving as American ambassador to Vietnam, finishing ahead of Barry Goldwater and Nelson Rockefeller, who were both on the ballot.

In 1968 Eugene McCarthy stunned the world and began the tortured path out of Vietnam with a breathtaking triumph in New Hampshire, and in 2000, John McCain electrified the political world with a dramatic victory in the Granite State.
It has been done before; it can be done again.
The reason that New Hampshire is, and should always be, the first primary in the nation is that it represents the truest example of citizen democracy on the most important matter before American voters, the election of a president.
This will be truer in 2008 than ever before.

http://pundits.thehill.com/2007/10/15/a-...

2.

Monica Smith
Thu, 10/11/07
4:15 pm

I'd like to suggest that what we're moving towards--i.e. progressing to--is human equality. It's an idea that's meeting with great resistance from people who feel inadequate unless they can subjugate someone else.
------------
3.

Susan Rowe
Thu, 10/11/07
4:47 pm

Thank you Monica. Your thought and words are indeed wise.
------------

I agree, it is THE DIRECTION!

However discussing move in that direction we have to be very caution and very precise not to screw it up.


Equality in what, in consumption or in capabilities/abilities?

Are we to declare certain equalities or to ensure/to warranty them? Is that enough (is it honestly?) to declare it without warranty in actually providing it?

Etc., etc., I mean equality/freedom/liberty/etc. is a tricky concept IF applied NOT for propaganda. These are first and foremost, imo, have an "economical" foundations and therefore can't be "decided" by majority of votes but must be resolved based on "economical feasibility" factor.

Air America Radio's - Randi Rhodes attacked in NYC park
by ZappoDave [Subscribe]
Mon Oct 15, 2007 at 11:40:19 PM PDT

It was announced on Air America Radio, Jon Elliot's show tonight, that Randi Rhodes was attacked in a park in NYC walking her dog.

There's nothing on the news yet.
ZappoDave's diary :: ::

From what he said, she's in the hospital.

She was not on the air today, and they had the Lionel Show on instead.

This is why she was not on the air.

Pardon this short diary, but it's late at night and I wanted to get this out.

I wish I had more to offer on it as far as information.

You would think it would be in the News.

Much love to Randi, and I hope she's ok.

We do know ... she's tough.

-----------------------------------------

A fellow blogger's account from the UK:



Get well soon, Randi Rhodes. I don't usually have time to listen to her show but I tend to leave AAR on when I'm in front of my computer - but when I heard Lionel sitting in for her, I just turned it off. Sorry, I just can't listen to him. But right now I'm listening to John Elliot and he says Randi was attacked last night while she was walking her dog. She wasn't carrying a bag and was just in sweats, and she was beaten up pretty badly and had some teeth knocked out. Elliot is saying it sounds like it was neither a sexual assault nor a robbery and he suspects it was political. The way things are going, he could be right.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/10/16...

Finally, a post worth mentioning...............this IS significant folks.........

TEHRAN, Iran - Russian leader Vladimir Putin met his Iranian counterpart Tuesday and implicitly warned the U.S. not to use a former Soviet republic to stage an attack on Iran. He also said nations should not pursue oil pipeline projects that are not backed by regional powers.

At a summit of the five nations that border the inland Caspian Sea, Putin said none of the nations' territory should be used by any outside countries for use of military force against any nation in the region. It was a clear reference to long-standing rumors that the U.S. was planning to use Azerbaijan, a former Soviet republic, as a staging ground for any possible military action against Iran.

want to share a concern with you all.

As you know I write letters to the edtior at times. we also have a comment section online with our local newspaper on issues and repsonses to letters to the editor.

I wrote a letter in support of our local candidate who is running for state senator.

I said he served on a local commision with me and I admired his work and the fact he listens to all.

Well about a week ago I was at a local festival working the candidates table.

This young man comes up to me and says my name and says "are you Linda B?" I was taken aback and said I was (my name).

Well he proceeded to tell me he went to the head of the commission I was on and asked my full name and she gave it to him.

She said I was a member of the commission.

Then this young man talks down to me about our candidate and continues to chastise me about my selection and how my LTE's were wrong. This tyrade went on for a few minutes. My coworkers sat there agast. I then told him to remove himself from our table. He then went over to the opposing candidate was and  worked for her.

Now on those same comments section he is using my full name and posting comments that are disgusting and also for the other candidate.

I feel like I am being stalked. He now knows my full name and who I am. This boy also went to school with my son and is now a minister who went to pat robertson 's university. I am kinda scared here folks. What should I do?

Neo-Cons Push for Hillary’s Nomination
by Paul Hogarth‚ Oct. 16‚ 2007

As I’ve written before, conservative pundits love Hillary Clinton and despise the party’s liberal base. While Karl Rove and George Bush have predicted that she will win the nomination, there’s a more basic reason why the right would be content with a President Hillary Clinton. It would not shift the political center of gravity, nor upset the current power structure where conservatives have flourished. In his October 12 column for the Washington Post, neo-conservative Charles Krauthammer lauded Hillary Clinton’s candidacy – calling her the “Great Navigator.” Never mind the rhetoric that she currently gives to win the primary, he said, for Hillary’s “liberalism is redeemed by her ambition; her ideology subordinate to her political needs.” While many liberals currently support Clinton, the right understands that – in a year where Democrats will probably win the Presidency – Hillary is the best that they can hope for.

http://www.beyondchron.org/articles/Neo_...

I feel like I am being stalked. He now knows my full name and who I am. This boy also went to school with my son and is now a minister who went to pat robertson 's university. I am kinda scared here folks. What should I do?

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Linda,

You already know the answer to that question............what happened to Randi Rhodes, for whatever reason will only galvanize her strength and conviction................maybe take an intoductory self defense class? Just in case..................

14.

linda b
Tue, 10/16/07
11:15 am


Know that you are not alone in having this experience.

Sorry about that, Linda b.   Many are afraid to write letters to the editors in our area critical of Republicans now.  Especially if your phone number is listed.   It is what our nation has become, sadly.  Thinking about you.  

Sorry about Randi's attack.

i'd suggest going to the local police and make them document your concern. then look into obtaining mace or a tazer. ask the cops. finally, try to not go anywhere alone. in the navy when we were in a foreign port we were supposed to follow the 3 man rule, i.e., bring 2 friends along to stay out of trouble.

Yes, there are a lot of people who fail to observe the proper boundaries and think that anyone who's name they know is somehow accountable to them. It isn't always antagonistic. When they're fawning, it's not quite as annoying.

In this day and age anybody can find out who anyone else is and where he/she lives. Which is why all the high tech spying the N.S.A. is doing is really a waste of time and money. But, that's another matter.

Anyway, it is scary to be verbally attacked by someone whom you hardly know, but you'll probably get used to it. You'll probably have to be a little more alert, so he doesn't surprise you. And maybe practice cutting off the tirade, if it starts again. Most such people like being asked about themselves. LOL

19. It's not new. There were crazies out there thirty years ago.

And then there are they guys in prison who use their phone privileges to call women whose phone numbers they happen to find in the paper. The paper should not be publishing the phone number. Most don't.

If you missed Howard Dean's speeches on C-Span Friday, here are links to the videos and summaries.

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1580

meant to leave this:

Leaders grapple for answers as foreclosures hit home
Frank suggests lenders could face tougher rules

By Ross Kerber, Globe Staff | October 16, 2007

US Representative Barney Frank yesterday suggested that subprime mortgage lenders will face tougher federal regulatory scrutiny unless they do more to work with their delinquent borrowers and help them avoid foreclosure.


"I want to serve notice. If these companies can't do a better job with service, their argument against regulation will be weaker," said Frank, the Newton Democrat who is chairman of the House Financial Services Committee, at a hearing in Roxbury yesterday.

Frank also said he will summon lenders to a meeting he has scheduled for next week to discuss how they can help reduce rising foreclosure rates.

http://www.boston.com/business/personalf...

I think that person thinks my posts are an afront to his take on things.

I am not personally afraid but this guy is a nut case, he says he has a master in theology? for what? he stands there and lies and then quotes the bible.

 I will continue to write letters but will limit my posts to that comment section.

crazy people.

i am really getting tired of having to hold these Congresscritters' hands. Seems like time would be better spent grooming new ones. Besides, this piecemeal health care thing is taking much too long. It made sense four years ago when Dean was the candidate................

Dear DFA Member,


It's up to you.
This is a very important week in the fight for Health Care for America and you can swing the vote.
President Bush vetoed an expansion of the State Children's Health Insurance Program (SCHIP) that would have expanded coverage to millions of America's uninsured children.
Congress can override the veto, but not without your help.
Thirty-five members of Congress have been identified as potential swing votes to override the veto. Your representative is not one of them. But thousands of DFA members live in each swing district and we need your help to encourage them into action today.
Will you call a fellow DFA member in a swing district now?
http://www.DemocracyforAmerica.com/DFA2D...

 My  Progressive Values Interview with Terry McAuliffe ,  ex chair DNC & chair  Hilary Clinton campaign  

Last Saturday 10/13/07, I interviewed Terry McAuliffe, former Chair of the Democratic Party and present chair of Hilary Clinton's presidential campaign and asked him, "What Are Progressive Values?" You can see his response here:
 http://youtube.com/watch?v=o3k19uxmxMo
I asked a few people there about his answer, see their comments at the end of the clip.

Terry's a very pleasant guy, and I was impressed that he would come and visit a small house party of Democrats in Richmond, CA. What do you think of his answer about Progressive Values?  I  find he veered off into issues instead of clearly explaining what Progressive Values are. What's your take?

Also, I found a video clip with Terry on the conservative show: Kudlow & Company. 
Kudlow asks Terry, "what has changed with Values and and Principles on the democratic side?" 
He poses the question at 1:25 on this clip.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VWhPXS2uJo

Jed Babbin the other conservative guest  then calls Terry on his non answer.

Is this an example of Progressives, Liberals and Democrats not being able to talk about Values?   I must say this is concerning that Terry can't debate on the Values level.

What does this say about the Hilary  Campaign?

What is the answer that Terry should have given?

edwin

For many people, God's purpose is to give them an excuse to tell other people what to do and to have them tell them what to do. They don't believe in self-direction. It scares them. If they get contradictory directions, they don't know what to do. They're not used to making choices and don't like it.

mprov

Did you see your interview on the Youtube Progressive Values group..?
http://youtube.com/group/ProgressiveValues

This is how they walke their dogs.  I tried putting 3 photos on the same comment but couldn't.  How do you guys do that?

http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p120/seashell_08/veggies.gif

Fruits and veggies right on the street.

bbl 

No time to read threads right now and that *&^% injury keeps coming back every time I dance or take a walk. 

29. yes i did.

what's the link to your clip?  I tried to incorporate most of the interviews in the piece?

We'll be at the party this weekend..  I'll bring my video camera if anyone would like to be interviewed..  Susan,, I hear you will be there..  edwin

http://www.takebackredcalifornia.org

Sunday, October 21, 2007

Time: 2:00 - 5:00 PM

Where: Marinwood Community Center, San Rafael

What: A chance to meet representatives from and learn about Red Counties of Northern and Central California. Sample their wares, wine and song and help raise money for races in the Red Counties. Josh Kornbluth will Emcee the program; more surprises to come!

34. http://youtube.com/watch?v=3dDPnKx9sFI

but, you don't have to use any of it in your produced work. i understand using the best content for a piece of work. and i don't feel left out. ok.

I decided to skim thru this thread and OMG, Linda B and Randi.  Prayers for Randi and yes, it sounds political.  Progressives, who represent most of Americans in most things, are no longer safe on the streets.  I'm appalled.

LindaB, go to the police, get this guy's name, buy mace or a tazer, keep your doors locked; maybe even buy a gun and learn how to shoot it. 

What has become of our country?

The news about Putin is HUGE.  Bush is managing to piss off both Russia and China.  It can't be incompetence.  He and his are actively looking for war on a very big scale.  IMO

Someone please explain how Pelosi is really trying to end the war with this genocide thing.  I'm missing some brain cells here.

bbl. 

linda b: mprov has some excellent suggestions. But yes, it is chilling to know that there are people like that (what is even more chilling is when they are in a group) ... and those are exactly the crazies that we have to take our country back from.

*****************
OK, Congress, why don't you listen to those who have been there, fighting the war for the armchair warmongers?

====================
The Real Iraq We Knew
By 12 former Army captains
Tuesday, October 16, 2007; 12:00 AM

Today marks five years since the authorization of military force in Iraq, setting Operation Iraqi Freedom in motion. Five years on, the Iraq war is as undermanned and under-resourced as it was from the start. And, five years on, Iraq is in shambles.

As Army captains who served in Baghdad and beyond, we've seen the corruption and the sectarian division. We understand what it's like to be stretched too thin. And we know when it's time to get out.

[...]
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con...

And yes, Congress, pay attention to this too.

================
A Duty to the Wounded
Our Newest Veterans Need Help Now
By Bob Dole and Donna E. Shalala
Tuesday, October 16, 2007; A19

It is time to decide -- do we reform the current military and veterans' disability evaluation and compensation systems or limp along, placing Band-Aids over existing flaws?

It has been more than 2 1/2 months since our commission presented its six pragmatic recommendations to improve the system of care for our injured service members and their families. Our recommendations are eminently doable and designed for immediate implementation. While progress has been made, more work remains. And the clock is ticking.

The vast majority of the steps needed to implement our recommendations must be taken by the administration. Since unveiling our report, we have met frequently with officials from the White House and the departments of Defense and Veterans Affairs. We are pleased that they are moving forward with several critical changes, including the development of recovery plans and assigning coordinators to oversee the care of our most seriously injured troops.

We have also testified before Congress and met individually with lawmakers. Overall, we are buoyed by the strong bipartisan support being given to the proposals.

Despite this support, however, it is clear that our recommendations are being swept up in a decades-long battle to reform the entire disability system for all service members. It is important to remember that our commission was tasked with improving care and benefits for those returning from the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. While we hope that our recommendations will help many others, our mission was to make the system work better for this new generation of veterans.

[...]
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con...

Al, just another reason why we NEED YOU!

=================
Redder or Bluer Than Thou
By E. J. Dionne Jr.
Tuesday, October 16, 2007; A19

One of the few things the Republican and Democratic presidential contests have in common is the relentlessness with which candidates on both sides are wrapping themselves in orthodoxy. Heretics need not apply.

It's true that primary contests are largely decided by the party faithful. And I'll concede that orthodoxy may be underrated, since we tend to trust people whose views are grounded in a set of principles.

"I did try to found a heresy of my own," said G.K. Chesterton, who wrote the book on orthodoxy, "and when I had put the last touches to it, I discovered that it was orthodoxy."

But if ever there were an election that demanded a break with the past, it is surely the election in 2008. Whoever takes over from President Bush will face unprecedented problems. Yet here are the Republicans bickering over who is the "true conservative" while Democrats scrupulously police their ranks for any signs of deviationism.

[...]
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con...

Today marks five years since the authorization of military force in Iraq

Lest we forget who stood where on that shameful day......

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote 

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2002/roll455.xml 

Here's the video where Vlad makes it very clear that Russia will support Iran's nuclear programme.

So much for Condi being able to accomplish anything on her most recent junket to Russia.

==============
Putin speaks in Iran
Iran's president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad with Russian president Vladimir Putin at a summit in Tehran, where they agreed on their right to develop a peaceful nuclear programme

[...]
http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/video/200...

That clip from Kudlow is interesting because it does illustrate that in talking about Democrats Republicans give the impression that they've been paying attention and are interested in the other side.
I think Democrats may be remiss in not paying sufficient attention to Republicans, talking past them, if you will.

The other problem traditional Democrats have is that they're still in the "government FOR the people" mode--i.e. give the people something--as opposed to the Republican "government OF the people--i.e. tell people what to do. Neither have gotten 'round to the "government BY the people" thing yet. You could say, they're still in denial. Pelosi identifying herself as a leader the other day is a good example.

Of course, the reason the paternalistic/maternalistic state persists is because a large percentage of the population is still infantalized. Well, OK, not large. Just 30%.

Leaders grapple for answers as foreclosures hit home
Frank suggests lenders could face tougher rules

Has he run that by the DLC? 

Perhaps Vlad's subtle hand is also at work here.

===================
India-US nuclear deal stalls indefinitely
Randeep Ramesh in New Delhi
Tuesday October 16, 2007
Guardian Unlimited

The controversial nuclear deal between India and the US has been put into "deep freeze" after the Indian prime minister told the US president, George Bush, "certain difficulties" had stalled the pact for the foreseeable future.

Described by the Bush administration as the "single most important initiative in the 60 years of our relationship"' the landmark agreement would have allowed India to become the first nation allowed to keep its atomic weapons and to trade in nuclear technology despite not having signed international treaties on non-proliferation.

Although India's prime minister, Manmohan Singh, had personally backed the deal, the government was unable to convince communist allies the agreement was in the country's interest.

In the two months since the pact was finalised, the row between Mr Singh and communist politicians, vital for his government's survival, has become increasingly bitter.

The communists' argument is that India's foreign policy is becoming subservient to the US, and that Washington is steadily moulding the country's economy. The nuclear deal, they say, tightens America's hold on India.

In the end, leftwing parties threatened to bring down the administration with an ultimatum: either back us or the US. The ruling coalition has another one and half years left before it needs to call for elections.That led, analysts say, to a government climbdown.

In Washington, the Indian embassy put out a statement saying: "The prime minister also explained to President Bush that certain difficulties have arisen with respect to the operationalisation of the India-US civil nuclear cooperation agreement."

[...]
http://www.guardian.co.uk/print/0,,33097...

mprov

O yes. I think  while skiming throught your clip I didn't catch the one word value I was looking for to make the clip..    

 I enjoyed the interview.. you're right close by... we should get together some time.. are you playing music around town? are you going to the Taste of Red counties , Marinwood Community Center, San Rafael, event.?

I know your into improv music.. I like contact improv dance..  you may find that interesting..
http://youtube.com/group/ContactImprov

here's a clip I made of CI
http://youtube.com/watch?v=7F2hhcL5Mv4

And Hugo continues working on yet another front against putzCo.

============
Chávez cements ties with Castro in growing anti-US alliance
Peter Walker and agencies
Tuesday October 16, 2007
Guardian Unlimited

Venezuela's president, Hugo Chávez, has signed a string of agreements in Cuba with the country's temporary leader, Raul Castro, reaffirming the countries' burgeoning anti-US alliance.
The pair agreed on a series of trade-related deals in Havana yesterday, in areas ranging from oil production to tourism.

Venezuela and Cuba "can form a confederation of republics, two republics in one, two countries in one", Mr Chávez said.

At the weekend, the Venezuelan president met Fidel Castro, the 81-year-old Cuban leader whose long convalescence from serious illness has seen him temporarily replaced by his 76-year-old brother, Raul, since last year.

[...]
http://www.guardian.co.uk/venezuela/stor...

And Clueless Condi continues with her streak of failures.

===============
US presses Palestinians and Israel to find common ground
· Rice speaks to Abbas and Olmert before conference
· Envoy says UN should consider leaving Quartet
Ian Black, Middle East editor
Tuesday October 16, 2007
Guardian

The US yesterday urged Israel and the Palestinians to work to overcome their differences before an international conference next month even as a top UN expert lambasted the "Quartet" of Middle East peacemakers for failing to promote Palestinian rights.

Condoleezza Rice, the US secretary of state, travelled to the West Bank town of Ramallah to try to persuade the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, to narrow gaps with Israel on a "declaration of principles" for the conference, provisionally scheduled to be held in Annapolis, Maryland, sometime next month.

Earlier she held talks with the Israeli prime minister, Ehud Olmert, who generated headlines by signalling that outlying Arab areas of Jerusalem could be surrendered in an agreement with Mr Abbas.

Until recently, the question of dividing Jerusalem - annexed after the 1967 war - was a taboo in Israeli politics, and it remains hugely divisive. There were "legitimate questions" about some of these suburbs, he said. But the issue of the city's holy sites has yet to be tackled.

"Frankly it is time for the establishment of a Palestinian state," Ms Rice said. "The US sees the establishment of a Palestinian state, a two-state solution, as absolutely essential to the future... We have got quite a long time to go but we are not going to tire until I have given my last ounce of energy and my last moment in office."

It is still far from clear, however, whether the Annapolis conference will go ahead. Arab states have said they do not want to attend if it is just a "photo-opportunity." Officials on all sides have hinted that the event could be postponed or cancelled if a positive outcome could not be assured. Palestinians say failure would undermine Mr Abbas and could trigger a new intifada.

And amid the wrangling, there was a reminder of the gap between rhetoric and reality on the ground with a warning from John Dugard, the UN's special rapporteur on the rights of the Palestinians.

"Every time I visit, the situation seems to have worsened," the retired South African law professor said in a BBC Radio interview. "This time, I was very struck by the sense of hopelessness among the Palestinian people." Mr Dugard attributed this to "the crushing effect of human rights violations", and to Israeli restrictions on Palestinians' freedom of movement.

Israel did face a security threat but "its response is very disproportionate". He said the purpose of some of the hundreds of Israeli checkpoints or barriers in the West Bank was to break it up "into a number of cantons and make the life of Palestinians as miserable as possible".

[...]
http://www.guardian.co.uk/print/0,,33096...

I decided to skim thru this thread and OMG, Linda B and Randi.  Prayers

...

Someone please explain how Pelosi is really trying to end the war with this genocide thing. 

...

+++

Ditto to what you said about linda B and Randi.  I know it must be a pain in the arse but might a companion (male or female) be in order when you go out, for the near future ?  That will prevent one being alone when out of the safety of your home and workplace.

As for what's up in Pelosi's head, I don't know.  But if the expected full House vote on H. res 106 in late Nov goes with the AYES having the majority to call the Armenian deaths in 1915 a genocide by Turkey, the latter have seemingly indicated, that just like they did with France two years ago after the French condemned Turkey, the Turks will end military cooperation with any country that condemns what happened in the past.

As it stands now, 70 % of all US air support and supplies into Iraq to US and Coalition forces, goes through Turkey.

If cooperation is cut off, where will the support and supplies suddenly come through ?  It would put the whole war in Iraq into crisis for the US generals there in the field and for Bush.  It could cause a redeployment out of Iraq of some or all of U.S. forces.

38.

I have been telling you for two years that Iraq and Iran are just surrogates for Russia and China, the guys they're really afraid of. Now, they're finally putting their cards on the table, telling the American people about their fears and hoping they'll be believed. Not likely. I'm not usually into predictions, but since the fear wasn't credible in the first place, expecting the American people who've been buying tons of stuff from China and are still basking in the glow of having bested the Soviet Union to now consider these countries the bad guys is not likely.

It's bad enough when we enrage our enemies, but when we also enrage our allies, then we know that the Decider's Administration is on thin footing indeed.

Unfortunately, our national prestige is on that same thin footing.

Al: we desperately need you.

====================
US 'delayed' British withdrawal from Basra
By Kim Sengupta and Anne Penketh
Published: 16 October 2007

British forces were prevented from pulling out of their last base in Basra City for five months because the Americans refused to move their consulate, according to senior military sources.

The US warned that a brigade of troops would be sent from Baghdad to take "appropriate action" to maintain security. The delay in withdrawal resulted in some of the fiercest fighting faced by British forces since the invasion of 2003, leading to the deaths of 25 British soldiers and injuries to 58 others, as well as dozens of Iraqi casualties. Two of the British dead were at the base, Basra Palace, while at least 10 others died in supporting operations.

Downing Street deemed it to be politically unacceptable for the Americans to replace British troops in Basra, as it would glaringly expose the growing differences between the two countries over Iraq. The British had decided that the end of March to early April would be an optimum time to hand over Basra Palace to the Iraqi authorities – after the completion of Operation Sinbad, aimed at militant groups.

But the Americans maintained that withdrawing the coalition presence from Basra, Iraq's second city, would pave the way for Iranian agents to move in. They claimed to have definite intelligence that elements of the al-Quds force were poised to infiltrate across the border from Iran when the British left. The British assessment did not support this scenario, holding that nationalism among the Shia population would supersede any affinity they felt with Shia Iran and that withdrawing from the palace would lessen violence.

[...]
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/midd...

I'm all for condemning genocide no matter whose toes get stepped on. But when Congress continues to ignore three centuries of genocide against our own people, it stinks of hypocrisy.

Obama is trying very hard to not fall into the "same old way" orthodoxy trap.

Thanks again, putzCo!

==================
Supply fears drive oil to record prices
By Nic Fildes
Published: 16 October 2007

Oil prices surged to a record high yesterday on the back of tension between Turkey and Iraq, adding to concerns over global supplies before the northern winter.

The oil price has risen steadily in recent months after dipping below $50 a barrel at the start of the year. After its recent gains, the crude price has quadrupled since 2002, although it still trails the inflation-adjusted peak of more than $90 a barrel set in 1979 during the Iranian revolution.

However, the price is seen as likely to match that record in coming weeks as several factors drive up the cost of crude. On the New York Mercantile Exchange (Nymex), crude prices soared past $85 a barrel for the first time to trade at $85.44. In London, the benchmark Brent crude closed at a record $82.75, passing $82 for the first time.

Citigroup, the US investment bank, said that a run at $90 a barrel is now seen as "reasonable" due to the weakness of the US dollar and resilient demand. James Neale, an analyst with Citi-group in London, said: "The higher near-term oil price reflects the current macro cocktail of tightening inventory balances in crude and particularly refined products." The bank raised its Brent oil price forecasts for the second time this year, adding $10 a barrel to its 2008 and 2009 forecasts to $70 and $65 a barrel respectively.

[...]
http://news.independent.co.uk/business/n...

36.

WhatAre Progressive Values
Tue, 10/16/07
12:22 pm



Yes, I'm attending. See you there.

The last for now ... on a lighter note ...

=================
Men only? You must be joking
A new survey has named the nation's top 10 wits – and there isn't a woman among them. But as Emily Dugan discovers, female humour has helped define our life and culture for centuries
Published: 16 October 2007

[...]
http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/this_br...

OK. Guys always feel that there's security in numbers. Guys do not like doing things alone. That's why they get married. Girls want to be independent. They have children and they want someone to help--take them off their hands. That's why girls get married.

The end result is good for children. Two parents is better than one. But, the motivation of the parents is different. Hey, it's our differences that make us whole.

And now the spouse wants me to go with him to buy nails. Since I'm the one who specified either aluminum or stainless steel and he couldn't find either on his own, I am now obligated to go with him. See how that works?

We let genocide in Africa happen right before our eyes and get worked up about another continent and another century?

still haven't issued a national apology for slavery either

I guess I'd let it slide, but they are "too busy" for impeachment.

$ 50 !  I hear $ 50 ! Do I hear a $ 60 !:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7047486.stm

Opening prices for the votes range from 1 peso ($0.30) to 300 pesos ($90).

Argentine electoral authorities say they can do little to stop the practice because it falls into a legal vacuum.

...

45. our next gig is at 21 Grand on 2 Nov. part of the oakland murmur art walk. our friend, claudine naganuma

http://dancenaganuma.com/artists.html

and 3 other dancers will be part of the show. i think we talked a little about art? sure, let's get some coffee or something, i'm always interested in expanding my circle of friends. don't know if i can make the san rafael event?

Obama is trying very hard to not fall into the "same old way" orthodoxy trap.

By refusing to committ withdrawl from Iraq and health insurance for all?

He's fallen into the wrong orthodoxy trap.

60.

* rdorgan
Tue, 10/16/07
1:04 pm
-------


Good point!

...lol, such an interesting turn (though absolutely logical within "free enterprise" business model)!

False "freedom" and "democracy" ridiculed to its very core!

I was told yesterday (in somewhat unfriendly language) that I am alone on this blog in my disrespect for DCDems these days. But it sure doesn't seem that way to me.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071016/ap_po/obama_rural_plan_2

Obama outlines rural policy plan

By MIKE GLOVER, Associated Press Writer

1 hour, 18 minutes ago

FAIRFAX, Iowa - Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama, seeking votes in Iowa, is offering a plan to aid smaller farms, expand the renewable fuels industry and establish incentives for organic production.

The Illinois senator is calling for a goal of producing 2 billion gallons of cellulosic ethanol by 2013 while ensuring that such an expansion doesn't increase pollution. Iowa leads the nation in ethanol production.

...

His proposal included:

• A $250,000 limit on subsidy payments to farmers as well as strict environmental rules and enforcement for large livestock operations.

• Creation of new cost-sharing programs to help farmers get certification as organic farmers, and revamping crop insurance programs to avoid penalizing organic producers.

• A goal of a 50 percent increase in the economy's energy efficiency by 2030.

• A change to allow small businesses to pool together to offer health insurance for workers, with subsidies for those who can't afford it. Also, overhaul the Medicare and Medicaid reimbursement system that can penalize rural areas.

• Loan forgiveness for doctors and nurses who practice in rural areas. Also, revamp community college programs to "reflect the increasingly dynamic and technical skills required for rural America to respond to a globalizing workforce."

Sitka
Tue, 10/16/07
1:13 pm
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Geez.........I wonder where that puts ME then?  Or Huron?

Phil Specht
Tue, 10/16/07
12:56 pm

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Certain genocides have always gotten preference over others it seems.............

Here's a video clip I saw:   Log Cabin Republicans TV Ad Campaign Sets the Record Straight About Mitt Romney . 

 The clip criticizes Mitt Rommey, but the interesting point comes at the end.  At  00:26, They Say with distain, "Mitt Romney, Massachusetts Values".  Now the Conservatives are basically criticizing every single resident  of Massachusetts.  Saying all residents of Massachusetts have inferior Values.   It surprises me that no one called them on this.  It surprises me that the residents of Massachusetts don't stand up to the Conservatives for their own values. Why do they let themselves be denigrated by Conservatives?

  I don't care about Mitt Romney being  criticized by  Conservatives.  But in the same breath they trash all residents of Massachusetts with Conservative Self-Righteousness.

 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Elx3UWmyAY4

former -

Indeed.  Argentinians, known for getting cosmetic surgery done, have now moved on to another fad ?  seashell might be able to more accurately chime in on this about the Argentinian psyche

Well, all I know if I was going to sell my vote, I would ask in return for Canadian currency, or some other currency that's rising in value.

part of the record oil prices have to do with a declining currency, some would label them a bargin if we can sucker the producers to take payment in dollars

49.

Monica Smith
Tue, 10/16/07
12:49 pm


I have been telling you for two years that Iraq and Iran are just surrogates for Russia and China, the guys they're really afraid of. Now, they're finally putting their cards on the table, telling the American people about their fears and hoping they'll be believed. Not likely. I'm not usually into predictions, but since the fear wasn't credible in the first place, expecting the American people who've been buying tons of stuff from China and are still basking in the glow of having bested the Soviet Union to now consider these countries the bad guys is not likely.
---------

Hopefully...., and IF so, shouldn't Americans stop of been afraid of "islamo-fascists" as well?
The Bush&Co. PNAC's task is getting heavier every day..., lol.

And now the spouse wants me to go with him to buy nails. Since I'm the one who specified either aluminum or stainless steel

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I've never heard of either, but galvanized don't rust.

69.

please don't remind me of rising oil prices

I'm not looking forward to this coming winter (I'm buying a number of small efficient electric space heaters, along with the wood burning stove I already have, to supplement greatly my home heating oil).

Right now, I'm just focused on going to a warmer clime for a month (but the falling dollar has made the hotel, air fare,etc all the more expensive).

Frankly, this current US economy sucks IMO.

Phil Specht
Tue, 10/16/07
1:18 pm

             Well it looks good, until you realize that the Democrats royally screwed up with this Armenian Genocide crap, and as the Middleeast decends into a full regional war, we Bush is likely to have his Iran excuse by next summer. 

* rdorgan
Tue, 10/16/07
1:25 pm

 http://skybus.com/

    I just booked a $20.00 round trip ticket to Fort Lauderdale at the end of March.  But the $10.00 one way tickets are going fast. 

65.

Sitka
Tue, 10/16/07
1:13 pm

....
I was told...that I am alone on this blog in my disrespect for DCDems these days. But it sure doesn't seem that way to me.

------------

Really?
I may found you been more critical of them then some others on this blog. As for the "disrespect"..., imo, big portion of "professionally registered" Demos..., lol, feel the same way these days.

61. I'll try to get over there.. I had been wanting to check out the first friday Oakland Art Walk.. 

I'd also like to get more connection to musicians.. since I'd like to line up music for some of my videos..  

70.

* rdorgan
Tue, 10/16/07
1:18 pm

...
Well, all I know if I was going to sell my vote, I would ask in return for Canadian currency, or some other currency that's rising in value.
-------

No rush Rdorgan, the descend we are experiencing now will follow by the ascend of ENORMOUS proportions..., wait and see..., might win much more!

75.

TTT -

I'm headed overseas, so the shuttle flights don't operate.  The problem is that domestically, ya don't really feel the dropping US $. Head to Europe or elsewhere and zounds.

61. Mprov

Talking about Art, We've done a lot with Artists, with taping Artist talks.. Here's an art site I created on youtube.

The International Open Studios Art Channel
lhttp://youtube.com/groups_videos?name=OpenStudios

Morning Folks,

Hey Seashell, thanks for the photos.  There's a short story about Argentina in last week's New Yorker.  Buenos Aires was compared to Paris and Berlin and Prague and Lyons, a combination of European city and country.

I remember several years ago when a former editor of the Chirstian Science Monitor talked about Laura Bush's working with the gangs of Los Angelos.  I wrote him a personal letter saying that I couldn't think of anything more ridiculous, that Laura Bush as a librarian and elementary school teacher had lots of exprience, talent, and skill that she could use to promote education, children, and civic infrastructure, but gangs??? This must have been after the re-election (right!) of George, and it was Rove's idea that she would highlight the problems of gangs.

What failure this woman has been as far as contributing to education, health, families!  I have a sense that she gave up any principles she had when she married this clown, and she's rested on her security and safety ever since.  She's a disgrace in my mind.

And this from a friend.  I'll post the URL and a description and in another posting, an excerpt.

Finally, we truly have an insance governance: nothing that is happening makes any sense: aggravating China with the medal for the Dalai Lama, threatening Iran, trying to undermine Putin, the Pentagon refusing to fund the reconstructive surgery of Afghannistan people who collaborated with us and were maimed by the Taliban (NPR) the cost of $450,000.00.

Here's the URL

*Matthew 7:3 (Look It Up)

By Cindy Sheehan

10/15/07 "**ICH* <http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/>*" -- - -I*t is truly touching the way First Lady Laura Bush cares about the people of Burma and is using her officiousness (oops…I think that may be the wrong word…or is it?) to bring attention to the admittedly horrible situation there. There are very few people in the world that would not sympathize with or become outraged when monks are beaten and killed because they protested high gas prices.

 

Arrgh, sorry for all the typos. 

Here's Cindy's essay.  I'll post it in its entirety.

I understand Laura’s concern for Burma and its brutal oppression under the military junta. I have those same concerns. However, a recent article in WaPo extolling Laura’s deep humanitarian concern mentions that she has visited 68 countries in her tenure as First Lady. I wonder if she has been to Iraq? I wonder if she has visited the millions of Iraqi and Palestinian refugees in Jordan and Syria who have been forced from their country by her husband’s tragic policies?

I wonder if Laura has read the most recent studies that say over a million Iraqis have been killed since her husband’s “shocking and awful”
on March 20. 2003? Does she feel the same compassion and concern for a country that has been plunged into violence and chaos by the person who sleeps (and very well by his own admission) right next to her every night?

Does Laura know that her husband’s hired guns in Iraq, Blackwater (and the rest) gun down Iraqis just because they can? Presidential Medal of Honor recipient, Jerry Bremer gave mercenary killers immunity when he was head of the Coalition Provisional Authority—-which was just really a military junta that morphed into a puppet government “led” by men put in place by BushCo and are kept in place as long as they tow the line that murders and displaces their brothers and sisters.

Doesn’t Laura know that her husband has authorized the torture of other human beings? Even though such inhumane acts such as water-boarding, sexual humiliation, desecration of religious symbols, extremes of noise and temperature are called “enhanced interrogation techniques” in our Orwellian BushSpeak age, it is torture no matter which way one strangles or manipulates the language. Just because the people being tortured are not red-robed monks, Laura, they are still people.

Hello, Laura: The people of New Orleans still don’t have homes to return to and our streets are filled with the homeless, sick, and hopeless.
Families can’t afford insurance for their children and are declaring bankruptcy or losing their homes while Laura’s spouse vetoes their hope.
Our jobs are going overseas to be performed by virtual slaves so Wal Mart can keep its shelves stocked. As a last resort, our children join the military to be misused because most people can’t afford the exorbitant costs of college or trade schools and unions have been busted under such “free” trade agreements as NAFTA/CAFTA. Laura’s husband has been good for his base, the “haves and have mores,” but the rest of us are becoming the “haves less.”

And I wonder if Laura knows or cares about the thousands of families here in the USA have been destroyed because of the Mister’s pre-emptive war for profit.

Laura is probably aware of all of these things, but I doubt if she cares, or she would be calling the United Nations to sanction America for its terrible deeds in Iraq and Afghanistan and here in the “Homeland.” Instead of holding conferences on the unspeakable situation in Burma, she would be marching with us on the streets to end the occupations of Iraq and Afghanistan and calling for the impeachment of her callously incompetent husband.

Everyone in the world deserves security and peace. Not just the people who the USA deem worthy of security. The hypocrisy of our system and the people who profess a personal relationship with Jesus Christ is stunning and sickening.

We cannot with any shred of decency or any pretense to moral superiority try and pluck the speck out of our neighbor’s eye when we look at the world through eyes that are blinded to our own abject failures and crimes.

Buy some eyewash, Laura.

–Cindy@CindyforCongress.org <mailto:%E2%80%93Cindy@CindyforCongress.org>
 

Heading out the door. FRoler always wants someone to do his homework for him. It explains his bad memories from school (aside from being the kid no one liked.)

================

sitka's at it again with his pathetic personal attacks.

Monica, Phil ~~ about nails, lol!

http://www.oldhousejournal.com/magazine/...

Citing Iraq plans, Richardson adviser defects to Biden campaign

COLUMBIA, South Carolina (CNN) – One of New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson's South Carolina advisers is leaving the presidential campaign because of Richardson's Iraq plan and signing up with Sen. Joe Biden.

Citing Richardson's liberal stance on Iraq, which would immediately remove all U.S. forces from Iraq, the campaign's South Carolina state co-chair Fletcher Smith said Biden's plan to divide Iraq into three federal regions is a more responsible plan.

"To me it's the only way this problem is going to be resolved," Smith said in a phone interview Saturday morning. "Right now we have a quicksand of a civil war, and I don't believe we can just pull out precipitously in a six month period of time without jeopardizing our interests in the region. We don't need another evacuation that we had in Vietnam.".....(more)

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2007/10/07/citing-iraq-plans-richardson-adviser-defects-to-biden-campaign/

FRED from OR
Tue, 10/16/07
2:38 pm
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Well, looks like Biden has the nomination and Presidency locked up with this major critical move...Im sure it will be the first story on Olberman tonite...........

new thread

http://www.blogforamerica.com/view/22593...

80. interesting project.

82. That must be an old article because the stainless steel were $8.50 a pound and the aluminum were $11.00 I went with the stainless steel--only three pounds. It's only a wood storage shed, after all, but cedar shingles to match the house. And yes, we're near the ocean (9miles as the crow flies).