dfa would be first with me if they did some training here in my neck of the woods.

come on down.

Dems continue to talk tough, then bend over and grab their ankles for Bush.

Losers!

Iraq's security forces are not capable of taking over from US troops within the next 18 months, a new report says.

___________________________________________________________________________

Bullshit...............they want their country, let em earn it.............................

drive by

Gore said "at this time."  I simply can't give up hope that he'll jump in or I'll get depressed.   No one is talking global warming and he'll not, IMO,  let Clinton walk off with it.

I'm wearing my Gore buttons  and people  are approving.  As prez, he can start to turn us around. If not, the lamebrain repug who'll beat  Clinton, IMO, will just continue the disaster.

What kind of Xtian is Dodd?  That spooks me enuf to cross him off my list if he's a kooky religious nut posing behind that pleasant exterior.  I have to go look that up. 

BUSH, ISRAEL, AND IRAN

http://www.counterpunch.org/christison09062007.html

We citizens of the U.S. who do not want our country to become involved in a greater war with Iran will not have most of the print and TV media with us, nor the military-industrial complex that wants more wars. The Israel lobby will desperately oppose efforts to impeach Bush and Cheney, because it will recognize instantly that the two top U.S. leaders are the lobby's strongest backers of war with Iran. At the same time, most of the Democratic Party leadership and all but one or two of the Democratic presidential candidates will be reluctant to support impeachment because they are competing with the Republicans in an effort to show that each party supports Israel more strongly than the other.

As one nation-state in a world of nation-states, Iran knows that it has every bit as much right to develop nuclear weapons as the U.S., Israel, and other present nuclear powers. Compared to Israel, Iran has both a population and a land mass that are much larger. So why is it permissible for Israel to have several hundred nuclear weapons and impermissible for Iran to have any? The answer given by Israel supporters that Israel never signed the NonProliferation Treaty of 1970 while Iran did, is spurious.

 to the extent that Iran's nuclear weapons potential is at all a real cause of present U.S. and Israeli aggressive policies toward Iran, these aggressive policies are being carried out more to benefit Israel than the U.S. It is actually likely that the main motive behind U.S. and Israeli policies (as was the case in Iraq) has nothing to do with nuclear weapons but is rather to bring about regime change in Iran and strengthen the joint dominion of the U.S. and Israel over the entire Middle East. This raises the broader question of whether such joint dominion is truly in the best interest of the United States, or whether it is favored in Washington mainly because it is being pushed by the Israel lobby.

Huron John
Thu, 09/06/07
2:03 pm
___________________________________________________________________________

I will be willing to bet that 3 months before the election, scores will leave both parties, espeically the Democrats and re-register as Independents..........................

WHEN GENERAL PETRAEUS SPEAKS, DON'T LISTEN!

http://www.counterpunch.org/lichtman09062007.html

On the cusp of General David Petraeus' report on the "surge" of American troops in Iraq we should recall one of the most important if neglected lessons of the war in Vietnam: Don't listen to generals.

During the Vietnam War, America's top generals were consistently wrong in their assessments and recommendations. The generals' display of bad judgment began a dozen years before America's withdrawal from Vietnam in 1975. In October 1963, with about 17,000 U. S. military "advisers" in Vietnam, the top U. S. commander, General Paul D. Harkins said, "I can safely say that the end of the war is in sight." General Charles J. Timmes the head of America's Military Assistance Command added, "we have completed" the job of training the South Vietnamese Army.

There are deep-seated reasons for the generals' misstatements and misjudgments. As we recently learned in the responses to the Abu Ghraib scandal and the death of Pat Tillman, the military is neither self-reflective nor self-critical. It believes in its ability to succeed in any mission, even when the challenges are cultural and political, not military, as in Vietnam and Iraq.

The real action next week will not come with General Petraeus' report. Like his Vietnam-era predecessors, he will predictably support administration strategy, although with enough caveats to give an aura of credibility to his testimony. The big question is whether the media and the Democrats in Congress will stand up to the general or will surrender again to the politics of fear, as they did in the push for war during 2002.

-----------------------------

THE DEMOCRATS WILL SURRENDER.......AGAIN

Good one, Huron.  Obviously the benefit goes to Israel while the US sinks into being a third world country.

Here's Dodd's religion from Wiki.  I'm leery of any strong Xtian in the WH.  Our founders were Deists and we've departed from those more sane spiritual beliefs.  And a Mormon wife doesn't fill me with warm  fuzzies either.  When people with strong biblical beliefs have great power, it's almost impossible for them to separate them.

The catholic church doctrine is regressive, misogynistic, arrogant, controlling and greedy.  And we want a prez who is Catholic?  I think not. 

Gore,  always Gore. 

The Latin Church is distinguished from the other sui iuris Churches not only by the use of the aforementioned liturgies, but also by customs, practices and Canon law distinct from those of the Eastern Churches. Canon law for the Latin Church was codified in the Code of Canon Law, of which there have been two editions, the first promulgated by Pope Benedict XV in 1917, and the second by Pope John Paul II in 1983. The canon law that the Eastern Catholic Churches have in common has been codified in the Code of Canons of the Eastern Churches of 1990.

In the Latin Church, Confirmation and Eucharist are normally administered only to people who have reached the age of reason, while in the Eastern Churches they are administered immediately after baptism, even for an infant.[6] Celibacy is obligatory for priests in the Latin Church, though in the Eastern Catholic Churches ordination to priesthood (but not to the episcopate) may be conferred on married men. Bishops in the Latin Church are appointed by the Pope through the local Apostolic delegate and various dicasteries of the Roman Curia, while the synods of Eastern patriarchal and major archiepiscopal Churches elect bishops for their own territory (though not outside it), receiving from the Pope only letters of recognition.

Now that Fllorida has your attention...and Bill Nelson our leader has gotten name recognition because of his battle on the DNC.....he will file a bill for regional primaries.    Guess he had to really really get your attention first.

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1478

And I feel some concern about the party here ceding him so much power, especially with the connections to the Fellowship.  His wife, Grace, is on the board of directors and in a prayer cell with Hillary.

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1474

it has not been a happy week for me and for many other Floridians.   I think that Florida had ulterior motives in all this.

That Clinton is part of the secret Fellowship is most alarming.

I don't care if they belong to the church of the flying banana if they keep church and state seperate.

.

2.

Huron John
Thu, 09/06/07
2:03 pm


Dems...Losers!
-------

Nope! And NEVER have been. Always alternated their winner status with Reps.

That is just this war with its coffins is not letting them hide and all Americans to see trhough....their true, "light" Reps face.

the rush up to be tray us's talk is and will be the lies we have seen before.

all these commissions are put out there for the media to lap up.

off with their heads or at least sign them up to go to iraq.

putzes.

linda b
Thu, 09/06/07
2:59 pm
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

petraeus/westmoreland...................no differance............will the people be just as gullible though?

Guess who co-filed the regional primary bill with Nelson?  Levin of Michigan.  Were they trying to get attention: Well, they did.

Now that Fllorida has your attention...and Bill Nelson our leader has gotten name recognition because of his battle on the DNC.....he will file a bill for regional primaries.    Guess he had to really really get your attention first.

I wonder just what Nelson's real intentions are here. Primaries have always been a states' right thing, absent any constitutional requirement for anything different.

The dates for them to be held has always been in the hands of the parties.

Maybe Nelson's controversial conservatism is confusing his mind! Maybe he also thinks he can sideswipe Howard Dean.

15.

Levin's decisions as of late have also been under scrutiny from Democrats, espectially those decisions relating to Iraq.

Put him and Nelson both on the list of "Democrats To Get Rid Of ASAP!

56.

Sitka
Thu, 09/06/07
3:14 pm

Reply to this

just talked to sheri at hq......

Speaking of which, next time you talk to her could you bring up the subject of FRED's incessant naming calling and bathroom vulgarity? I'd like to know if she has no problem with that either, since that's the way it seems

=====================

Yea, right, and don't forget to tell her who I use it on, either, who provokes it. Who asks for it. I am sure she'll understand.

You intentionally do whatever it takes to piss off people with whom you don't agree, Sikta.

Everyone is familiar with your one-liner scumbag "humor" that slanders people, twisting their words and meanings into something they are not.

Everyone knows that you are in perrenial attack mode for those who disagree with you and that provoking and slandering are what you do.

Intelligent debate and discussion never enters the picture for you.

Sideswipe.....may be the right word, Joan.  More to all this than meets the eye.

RIP, Luciano, greatest of the great. 

hey sitka, got a phone? call hq yourself.

make my day.

11.

the church of the flying banana

Yikes, Phil, LOL.

The problem with Nelson's (and that of Hillary, Ashcroft, Mikaka, GWB, and other equally fizzed outs) has been "part of a secretive religious group that seeks to bring Jesus bqack to Capitol Hill" and whose goal is "a leadership led by God -- leaders of all levels of society who direct projects as they are led by the spirit." -- Mother Jones, Sept/October 2007, pages 48 - 51.

IMHO, that does not reflect intentions that keep religion and government separate.

I am amazed there is not more on this subject elsewhere or in the mainstream TV media. Maybe just a matter of time.

Other names in this group: Joe Lieberman, Tom Coburn, Mary Pryor, Doug Cor, Jesue Christ (no kidding on the list), James Inhofe (no surprise there), Sam Brownback (nor there either), Mother Teresa, Rick Santorum, etc.

Mary Pryor = Mark Pryor

21.

linda b
Thu, 09/06/07
3:33 pm

Reply to this

hey sitka, got a phone? call hq yourself.

make my day

============

good one - yea, make my day too

floridagal

I becoming convinced Bill Nelson is more right-wing that Gov. Charlie C.

22.

Joan* In*Florida
Thu, 09/06/07
3:36 pm

===============

I think we are making it bigger than life - politicians always kissed babies and talked about faith in God - nothing new there - what is new is giving money to churches ("faith-based" crap) and talking about moslems, like "they" (right-wingers like to use the pronoun) are from the devil.

It wasn't so long ago that there were people like KKK that believed they had a mission from God to lynch African-Americans.

Hi Fred,

I have to strongly disagree with you today.

I do not want another president who has any part of a "Fellowship" that is cozy with the radical-religious organizational people, especially one that finds it necessary to be on the secretive side of things.

No more "I was sent here by God" presidents for me regardless of party. 

I am alarmed to learn my own senator, though I have never liked him anyway, is a member of just such a group and his wife on the board of directors.

I intend to do much more research on this.

I think we are making it bigger than life - politicians always kissed babies and talked about faith in God - nothing new there
--------

That's true..., "nothing new there".
Except may be...: people are getting tired from that regular b***tish show off our professionals do.

bbl.

27.

Joan* In*Florida
Thu, 09/06/07
3:58 pm

Reply to this

Hi Fred,

I have to strongly disagree with you today.

I do not want another president who has any part of a "Fellowship"
====================

I am really familiar with the "fellowship" maybe if you were more specific I might or might not agree. I am speaking in the abstract.

Maybe I am missing something, but what organization a politician is "cozy" with, be it religious or otherwise, is not my concern. It may get them some votes and lose others' votes.

So long as the group is not doing anything illegal and unethical, and that there is no quid pro quo, regarding that group, regarding laws or government funds.

sorry - I meant to say I am really "NOT familiar" with the fellowship - busy with the kid

When did linda b join Club FRED?

SIROTA EXPOSES DEMOCRATIC LIES

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-sirota/on-iraq-whats-more-disg_b_63287.html

If you read the news very carefully, you can see exactly what is going on inside the Washington debate over the Iraq War. One party is lying, and one party is telling the truth - but which ones are doing what may surprise you (or, perhaps, not)

First, the lie, otherwise known as the Innocent Bystander Fable.

In a story headlined "Democrats Retreat on War End," The Politico notes that congressional Democrats are - once again - moving towards endorsing a legislative effort to cut the most unpopular president in contemporary American history a blank check to continue the most unpopular war in contemporary American history. Within this story, comes the lie to justify it all:

"The strategic shift is certain to anger some war critics, but it reflects the reality that Democrats lack the votes to force President Bush's hand. 'We are trying to manage expectations that we can't end the war today or next week or next month,' said one Democrat involved in the discussions. 'We have to make sure everyone understands that.'" (emphasis added)

Anyone who has read the U.S. Constitution knows this is a fabrication. Congress has the power of the purse, meaning it has the ultimate veto over the war. Democrats control both chambers of Congress, meaning they have the ultimate veto over the war. If they chose not to schedule a vote to give Bush a blank check, the war would end. The whole idea that they "can't end the war" is the highest form of dishonesty.

3.  Dodd is a Catholic.  I think Jo said this morning that he's Latin Rite.  What that means is that he prefers to hear the mass said in Latin.  Which I prefer myself since it helps to shut out the day-to-day and make it more of a meditative experience.  Also, in a sense, the priest's sermon, delivered in the vernacular, doesn't carry as much weight.  Which, I suspect is why the clergy preferred the change-over to (in our case) English.  It made their words sound just as important as the words from the bible.

Being married to a Mormon actually makes Dodd not a true-believer since it wasn't so long ago that such "mixed marriages" were forbidden, unless the church granted a special dispensation and the non-believer made an effort to convert and, at the least, promised that the children would be raised in the Catholic faith.

The world is full of "fallen-away" Catholics who've rejected all the fru-fra and rigamarole, but still live a principled life--i.e. following the teachings of Jesus and trying to practice the virtues, like

humility

poverty

charity

forgiveness

and do penance for the wrongs they commit, being fallible humans

One of the "advantages" of Catholicism (which some people consider a negative) is that confessing one's sins and doing penance and making a conscious commitment to sin no more rather effectively erradicates guilt--an emotion that can gnaw at the soul and prevent the individual from progressing in his life.  Some people think that guilt is useful as a preventative, sort of a reminder not to engage in a particular behavior again.  I disagree.  I think that all too often people do commit the same behavior again as if to steel themselves and prove that it wasn't bad to begin with. 

Iraq's security forces are not capable of taking over from US troops within the next 18 months, a new report says.

It's the "18 Month Plan."

Every 18 months they tell the fed up public that it wil take only 18 more months. 

SIROTA'S PUNCHLINE

 I can't tell what's more disgusting: Being lied to by Democrats about their supposed powerlessness, or having the GOP tell the American people the war must continue and American troops must continue getting killed, all because it is supposedly good for the Republican Party's political fortunes. What I can say is this: It is clear that less than a year after a national election that saw the American people demand an end to the war, both parties are going out of their way to continue it - because to folks in Washington, D.C., no matter how many people die, the whole tragic affair is all just a big game.

31.

Sitka
Thu, 09/06/07
4:23 pm

Reply to this
21. linda b

When did linda b join Club FRED?
==============

Club Fred, bullshit. You are the one always implying, bragging about how no one supports me, and everyone agrees with you.

You have a simple formula just make sure everything you say is established as boiler-plate "left" against the center - no matter how nasty and insidious you are - no matter what the issue - and everybody who disagrees with you is against the "left"

Well, the world is more complicated than "left" and "right" and there's more to the blog than your dividing the posts as belonging to one side or the other.

You are the one always implying, bragging about how no one supports me, and everyone agrees with you.

FRED thinks what he only imagines is real. Scarey. 

You have a simple formula just make sure everything you say is established as boiler-plate "left" against the center - no matter how nasty and insidious you are - no matter what the issue - and everybody who disagrees with you is against the "left"

FRED is even unaware that he's the only person on this blog who even uses the term "left." 

Well, the world is more complicated than "left" and "right" and there's more to the blog than your dividing the posts as belonging to one side or the other.

Yet that is what FRED boils every issue down to -- while always agreeing with the "right." 

He attacks others by describing himself -- how rovian! 

31. To answer your question in the abstract. Probably when she saw how low you went on the disability issue with your "humor" and she got caught in the crossfire as an innocent casualty - and I felt terrible about it.

37.

Sitka
Thu, 09/06/07
4:45 pm

FRED is even unaware that he's the only person on this blog who even uses the term "left."

==================
What the hell is that supposed to mean? Who the hell are you, the grand wizard of witch-hunts?

Ever read the book, "What's Left?" It was written in the middle of the Reagan revolution, about what the identity of "left" is. I read it, but gave it to my Republican brother. I am not sure you know the meaning of left, liberal or progressive - you're just following the crowd and think that hugging the term - and those who identify themselves as such - is safe - try winning elections.

Democrats would still be in the minority if all Democrats thought like you - and Republicans, the majority.

What the hell is that supposed to mean?

It means that raely does anyone on this blog but FRED describe themselves or others as "left." "Progressive" is what most use, with a few "liberals" like me to round it out. 

Only FRED calls people "left" -- and virtually always in a pejorative sense.

Democrats would still be in the minority if all Democrats thought like you

That's a curious statement, since when Democrats thought like me they controlled Congress for the better part of 6 six decades and the WH for the better aprt of four.

Since they started thinking like FRED they've been betraying their own party's platform and losing. 

40.

Sitka
Thu, 09/06/07
5:04 pm

Since they started thinking like FRED they've been betraying their own party's platform and losing.

==================
You live in your own little world, and it is very small indeed - far from reality.

40.

Sitka
Thu, 09/06/07
5:04 pm

Only FRED calls people "left" -- and virtually always in a pejorative sense.

====================
pejorative - my ass - only in your mind - another example of your perverted slander presented as truth.

When you can't refute the fact -- attack.

Here is one who is not lieing about the powerlessness of Congress.

Just received an e-mail from Chris Dodd. He said that Congress is getting ready to give Bush a BLANK CHECK. He said they're thinking of including only suggested timetable.

DODD SAID IF THERE IS NO DEFINITE TIMETABLE THE DEMS HAVE LOST HIS DEMOCRATIC VOTE.

He's asking everyone to call their Senators.

Dodd's plan:

50,000 troops out by 1/31/08

COMPLETE redeployment by 4/30/08

No additional funding for war after 4/30/08

Make funding of war during redeployment period contingent on progress of redeployment.

I just talked to his office, and he DOES MEAN COMPLETE WITHDRAWAL.

cALL THE SENATORS and ask them to support the Dodd Ammendment.

When FRED thought he was going to get kicked off the blog he got nice for 24 hours. When nothing happened it obviously emboldened him to be his true self again.

But that's OK. I prefer him that way since he can't be friendly without getting "teacly." 

37. "He attacks others by describing himself -- how rovian!"

=================
Now he compares me to Rove.

Technically, you have it wrong too, Sitka. Carl Rove attacked the opposition's strengths, not their weaknesses.

never heard this crap about "describing one's self" sound more like Sitkonian bullshit.

Dodd's plan:

50,000 troops out by 1/31/08

COMPLETE redeployment by 4/30/08

No additional funding for war after 4/30/08

It's better than some. But it seems the only way to get Bush's attention is to defund now. 

44.

audrey.nc
Thu, 09/06/07
5:23 pm

Reply to this


Here is one who is not lieing about the powerlessness of Congress.

Just received an e-mail from Chris Dodd. He said that Congress is getting ready to give Bush a BLANK CHECK. He said they're thinking of including only suggested timetable.
=====================

We don't need a timetable. What we need is a political solution and that will get the troops out ASAP simultaneously as that solution is deployed.

Carl Rove attacked the opposition's strengths, not their weaknesses.

Like FRED, Rove has often employed attacking opponents with what Bush himself is guilty of. It innoculates Bush while smearing the other with untruth. Brilliant in a Goebbelsian way.

45.

Sitka
Thu, 09/06/07
5:26 pm

Reply to this

When FRED thought he was going to get kicked off the blog he got nice for 24 hours. When nothing happened it obviously emboldened him to be his true self again
=============

That's bullshit too. I wanted to get kicked off, because that would mean that we had a moderator, which means you would have to behave yourself. You cannot smell your own shit, do you?

Sitka, you are the one instigating all the exchanges since then. Everybody can see that. You always fire the first shot.

Defunding now ain't gonna happen, unless we all head that way with our rolling pins.

And I always let you have the last word, Sitka, because you want to keep going with it.

I wanted to get kicked off, because that would mean that we had a moderator, which means you would have to behave yourself.

FRED tried to throw himself on his own sword  -- for the blog?

I'm feeling a little verklempt. Talk among yourselves.

on cnn right now. osama to talk to us on sept 11. is he at the white house right now making plans?

This is just outrageous. This shows that bush was in on 9.11. everytime bush wants to win he tries to scare us.

yea I am scared - of bush and his like.

impeach, NOW>

Defunding now ain't gonna happen, unless we all head that way with our rolling pins.

I don't have a rolling pin. But I have a vote -- which the Dem leaders in DC don't seem to want.

Sitka,
Sorry dude i just skipped all comments with derF mentioned, but couldn't help seeing the above.
Is that you in the fro?

on cnn right now. osama to talk to us on sept 11. is he at the white house right now making plans?

I think Bush has gotten all the mileage he can out of the fact that he's never caught or killed Uncle Osama.

BushCo wants a new war with Iran and reminding people that he still hasn't finished his old ones isn't condusive to it.

Is that you in the fro?

Sitka of the Seventies! 

Sitka, LOL....Deaniac.....Mike Meyers, verklempt.....another one of his great impersonations.

and LADIES, Mike Meyers is on the market again. Single. :) Maybe we'll get Look Who NOW Married an Axe Murderer (2) :)

Very interesting!

I posted a serious proposal, something like what we're supposed to be about on this blog.

AND THE HISSY FITS GO ON...

One dismisses it with a simple statement of a political solution. Words that just postpone the inevitable. The other doesn't think it's good enough.

NOTHING IS WHAT WE'LL GET. As you were.

I posted a serious proposal, something like what we're supposed to be about on this blog.

In all fairness, audrey, Dodd voted for going into Iraq and to fund it, and has only recently changed his stripes in time for this primary campaign. Just because he sent you a political email is no reason for others to swoon over him. But yes, let's hope he does what's been right along.

Note to linda b; it seems that the double posting of youtube(s) is what locks up some of us. maybe being easy on the 'submit comment' would help.
I'm not on your case, well not much, but in the 'do unto others' category i'd not do it to you(the double posting - locking up the blog thingy).
BTW, i've been at a light speed college connection all day and it still freeezes for 45 minutes. JFYI

61.

audrey.nc
Thu, 09/06/07
5:51 pm

Words that just postpone the inevitable. The other doesn't think it's good enough.

NOTHING IS WHAT WE'LL GET. As you were.

========================
A political solution is a monumental undertaking - easy to express, but it is anything but simple to engage and execute.

One problem is pretty simple, though. An ethnic majority composing the central government use "democracy" as a tyrannical tool, and uses its national police force to moonlight as death squads - with our blessing - a major part of the political problem.

Your scenario is your opinion. It is not the political solution of which I speak.

Sitka
Thu, 09/06/07
5:48 pm

i had an almost perfect, and natural at that, Peter Frampton doo in 'the day'. My hair dresser friend would make old bluehairs paying her big cake get out of the chair to just trim the ends.
Her male stylist would make me very nervous, but it was all in good fun.

Those...
were...
the...
days.

Osama Bin Forgotten really hasn't enjoyed only coming out at election time for his good buddy the Bush's.

He was delighted to get word that the war efforts are losing momentum and his services were needed again.



"Breaking News
Osama bin Laden will address the American people in a new video on September 11, a terror monitoring group says."


www.cnn.com

63.

Deaniac in GA
Thu, 09/06/07
5:57 pm

=============
I set up a home network last week in my house from parts i got in a yard sale, and it worked fine, but YouTube locked up on me there too. So I unhooked it and went back to one computer on DSL, and using a dialup on the other one (Qwest is pretty cool they give you a dialup free with DSL.)

Note to linda b; it seems that the double posting of youtube(s) is what locks up some of us. maybe being easy on the 'submit comment' would help.
I'm not on your case, well not much, but in the 'do unto others' category i'd not do it to you(the double posting - locking up the blog thingy).
BTW, i've been at a light speed college connection

kiddo, I talked to sheri and she said it should not lock up for anyone, even dial ups.

I don't do it to piss people off. I just thought the videos were funny.

sheri said she will have the tech people look at it.

they have set it up for youtube to be used on dfa. they don't want links all the time.

I will not do doubles again. if that will help.  but I can't be responsible for what u don't have on your computer.

dfa has put youtube availabilty on the blog.

if u have any problems, call sheri, she will explain it to you.

Deaniac......Peter Frampton....auh, the memories indeed. My 2nd concert, first being Boston. So much...uckm ...stuff floating around.....I got my first contact high big time at his concert in Miami. My Mom picked me up from the concert and took me to Dunkin Donuts to satisfy my munchies. Everyone there was laughing at me. But those donuts sure tasted good.


Peter Frampton moved to Cincinnati. I never had the good fortune of running in to him, but he lives in Paul Hacketts neighborhood.

hey linda b......of course you don't do it to piss people off!

I sure enjoyed the song....I'm waiting to share it with hubby. He doesn't get to play that stuff at work. :( The place he could use the most stress relief.

Thank you.

DEMOCRATS SWOON......

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/miles-mogulescu/congressional-dem-leaders_b_63375.html

Gen. Petraeus hasn't even given his much touted (White House written) report and already Congressional Democrats are in full retreat mode. As Buchanan put it , "George W. smells it. He no longer fears the power of Congress, and his rhetoric suggests he is contemptuous of it. He is brimming with self-assurance that he can break any Democratic attempt to impose deadlines for troop withdrawal and force Congress to cough up all the funds he demands...What is to prevent Bush from attacking Iran and widening the war, at a time and place of his choosing, and sooner than we think? Nothing and no one."

Congress has the Constitutional power of the purse strings. Early in the summer Democrats passed a funding bill with a timeline for troop redeployment which Pres. Bush vetoed. They then voted to continue funding the war without conditions other than a future report on the progress of the war. (Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton snuck in at the end of the roll call to cast votes against continued funding, but offered no leadership.)

The strategy that is not futile is for Congress to keep sending Bush a funding bill that requires a timeline for troop redeployment. If Bush vetoes it, they can send the same bill back to him again. If he vetoes it again, they can send it back once more. If he keeps vetoing the bill, then it is Bush who is not "supporting the troops." And if Republican Senators filibuster the bill, then they're the ones "not supporting the troops".

The Democrats fear that Bush will accuse them of not "supporting the troops". But the Congressional Democrats have never tried to challenge this false frame. Spending $3 billion a week while troops die in a futile attempt to step into the middle of a civil war in Iraq is not "supporting the troops". Supporting the troops is to redeploy them in an orderly manner to get them out of harm's way in an Iraqi civil war. Military victory in Iraq is impossible and the Iraqis show little interest in a political settlement.

John Edwards has already shown Presidential-caliber leadership and issued a strong and articulate statement: "In 2006, the American people elected a Democratic Congress to change course and end this war. It's the whole reason the American people voted for change. Yet, 10 months after the election, we still have the status quo and Congress has failed to do the people's will. That might be they way they do it inside the Beltway, but it's not the American way. It's time to stand up for the American people and against President Bush's failed, stubborn policy. Without a firm deadline, a small withdrawal of only some of the surge troops won't cut it--that's not a solution, it's an excuse. Congress must not send President Bush any funding fill without a timeline to end this war. No timeline, no funding. No excuses."

John Edwards is no longer in the Senate and can't do anything concrete at this time. Hillary and Obama can, but so far, they have been silent. They can lead a new charge by the Democratic troops...or they can continue to slink off and make quiet roll call votes in the dark of night. They can also show real leadership by working together with each other and other anti-war Senators like Chris Dodd and John Kerry for the good of the country, instead of trying to make the other look bad.

This is a test of Presidential leadership. If Hillary and/or Obama fail it, they have no right to be the Democratic nominee for President. Only John Edwards, among the front runners, has that right at the moment. As far as funding the war without a timeline for withdrawal, the Democrats slogan must be, in the words of Bruce Springsteen, "No Retreat, No Surrender" to George Bush.

We don't need to swoon over any of them, but Dodd is willing to UNFUND now. Who else is?
And Fred, yes a political solution would take time, and time is exactly what we shouldn't be spending there.

Can't believe that Osama is pre-notifying the AP of his coming 9-11 address.
Maybe he will have a 'mission accomplished' banner in the backdrop.

From 71. Pat Buchanan's view of dismal dems:

As Buchanan put it , "George W. smells it. He no longer fears the power of Congress, and his rhetoric suggests he is contemptuous of it. He is brimming with self-assurance that he can break any Democratic attempt to impose deadlines for troop withdrawal and force Congress to cough up all the funds he demands...What is to prevent Bush from attacking Iran and widening the war, at a time and place of his choosing, and sooner than we think? Nothing and no one."

If the primary polls would strongly suggest that Dodd is moving up fast mainly because of his get out of Iraq plan, that might send a strong message to the other candidates in every race.

Dodd is a strong, very "electable" candidate. Maybe that is why the media doesn't want to give him a looksee or more than a few minutes in any debate. The airwave media has decided for us who the "top tier" is and that is all we poor brainless Dems should be concerned about.

JUST GOT THIS IN MY EMAIL

This Sunday, Senator Joe Biden will appear on NBC's Meet the Press. We hope you'll tune in!

For more information, check your local listings.

We don't need to swoon over any of them, but Dodd is willing to UNFUND now. Who else is?

Kucinich

72.

audrey.nc
Thu, 09/06/07
6:24 pm

And Fred, yes a political solution would take time, and time is exactly what we shouldn't be spending there.

=======================

NO I did not say TIME - I said "monumental" meaning, huge.

Not the same thing. We need to bring in many parties and entities, inside and outside the country. This tremendous participation will condense the time.

Most of the changes and political solution have been thought out for years and months by many interested parties and knowledgeable individuals. We (meaning the Iraqis and all helping parties) won't be at square one.

It is ripe to happen. It just needs the right leadership and the fact established that the occupation will be ending and we need to work fast to leave things in their proper place for peace and stability.

77.

Huron John
Thu, 09/06/07
6:48 pm

We don't need to swoon over any of them, but Dodd is willing to UNFUND now. Who else is?

=================

I think all Democrats were willing to unfund last time, but were unwilling to stop the government over a veto and/or filibuster. There were also some sorely needed riders in the bill.

72.

audrey.nc
Thu, 09/06/07
6:24 pm

And Fred, yes a political solution would take time, and time is exactly what we shouldn't be spending there.

=======================

Also, I believe I said a political solution could be simultaneous with the drawdown and exit strategy

Simultaneous = at the same time

48.

FRED from OR
Thu, 09/06/07
5:30 pm

===========
response to
44.
===========

We don't need a timetable. What we need is a political solution and that will get the troops out ASAP simultaneously as that solution is deployed.

Dodd is willing to UNFUND now. Who else is?

If I remeber rightly, Hillary and Obama voted against the last funding measure too. Can't remember about Biden. Let's hope all of them don't this time and hold them accountable if they do.

And Fred, yes a political solution would take time, and time is exactly what we shouldn't be spending there.

That's right. The less the better. 

This Sunday, Senator Joe Biden will appear on NBC's Meet the Press. We hope you'll tune in!

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz. 

So....I was at the supermarket and a youngish woman stopped me and asked, "What does Support the Separation of Church and Hate mean," referring to one of my bumper stickers.  So I told her and she asked, "Have you ever known any hateful fundamentalists personally?"  And I said, "Yes, and they all have told me I'm going to Hell."    She started talking about sin and I told her about the original definition, which she knew...missing the mark....and then I brought up gay marriage and she said she doesn't believe in it and I asked why and this is what she said...ready for this?  "It makes me sad to see them hurting themselves."  I replied, "What gives you the right to think you know what's hurting them?"  And she went on about how sad they were....there were so many illogical and inconsistent statements coming from her, I was overwhelmed.  And then she said, "I'm surprised you're not getting angry."  (actually I was mentally strangling her) I asked her again what gave her the right to tell others how to live and she couldn't answer until I answered for her..."the bible?"  She said yes, the bible.

Discussion over.  And this was a nice seemingly bright fundi.  She didn't like me asking "What right do you have?"  She ended it by saying she had children at home and blah blah  and I told her I was a gay Buddhist!!!  

Doncha love people who claim not to hate when they do their best to prevent others from being happy?  I was getting to that and she was getting nervous. 

I don't believe in burning books.  The bible, the OT and most of the new, would be an exception.  

This secret Jesus organization in FL, which Clinton belongs to, is an example of how far away from rational thinking we've gone.  Fundi law is fast becoming the rule, not the crazed fringe. 

If these holier-than-thou folks understood anything about the teaching of Jesus, they would know that you can't bring Jesus back to the Hill, or Congress or the people or anything else.  The Spirit of Love doesn't dash around, it sits still in all of us, buried deeper in some more than others.

 Damn, I'm eloquent sometimes.  LOL

Bumper sticker I saw today.

I support the troops and am scared of Bush. 

OBL and 9/11 and the coming speech.  I wonder if the dry drunk's writers are writing it?  Bush knew.....................

Fine, they can do a political thing while they're deploying. Let them do it within Dodd's time framework. They don't need to string it out.

Frankly Guys and Gals, unless Gore steps in I think we're done.  Cheney has given the drunk the throne, along with his fundi and ÅIPÅC friends.

All our letters and calls are being ignored.  They will cut the check, send us the bill to give to our grandkids and more blood will soak the halls of congress.

I will not vote for a single dem who votes to fund the bloodbath.

*****************************

 I had an X-ray of my hips today due to a nasty sprain dancing.  And I've been told by my MD acupuncturist to do NOTHING this whole week except go wading 1/2hour a day.   Tonight is the town hall with my critter and I wanted to go....darn.  No dancing, no walking, no yoga, nothing...............

bbl.  I have to find someplace to wade.  LOL 

Huron John....

Kucinich or Dodd, can't we support both. The point is the Senators need to hear from us because they'e getting ready to sell us down the river again. Dodd has an ammendment no funding with a time table.

BTW,  I'm not gay... but definitely lean towards Buddhism.  I wanted this woman's reaction and she said, "Well, that's OK, we can still talk."

How truly Fundi of her.  If gays are sad, maybe it's becuz people like her are shoving their illogical OT bible in their faces, making them feel like pariahs. 

Walk a day in my shoes: Joe Biden/Marshall Clemmons

fun new video of Biden campaign (03:00)

Biden spends the day helping the Custodial Engineer (Union member)in a Cedar Rapids, Iowa school do his job - then goes home and has dinner with his family

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0mRRr940...

88. audrey.nc

=============
Sorry you cannot get excited about the political solution. It could save millions of lives, and has the potential for bipartisan support and national consensus.

The point is the Senators need to hear from us because they'e getting ready to sell us down the river again.

I think the DCDem leaders made their point last time. They WILL sell us down the river no matter how many calls and emails they get. That's because they're confident liberals will resign themselves to it and vote Democratic in 08. They obviously didn't learn a thing by losing every congressional election from 1994-2004.

Sorry you cannot get excited about the political solution.

Bush-lite is no solution. 

It could save millions of lives,

As long as we're making up figures and speaking of possibilities, getting out all the way  and immediately could save millions more.

and has the potential for bipartisan support and national consensus

Republicans will never agree to any Democratic plan. Unlike Democrats, their game plan doesn't begin with bluster and end with capitulation.

National consensus? We already have it -- out now.

fun new video of Biden campaign...... Biden spends the day helping the Custodial Engineer (Union member)in a Cedar Rapids, Iowa school do his job - then goes home and has dinner with his family

Yes, it's funny how Biden pretends to do what he really should have done with his life. 

91.

seashell :-)
Thu, 09/06/07
7:29 pm

Reply to this


BTW, I'm not gay... but definitely lean towards Buddhism. I wanted this woman's reaction and she said, "Well, that's OK, we can still talk."



----

Wow, wasn't that big of her! (sic)

A (PBS) NOW exclusive investigation

Roughly one in seven of America's active duty military soldiers is a woman, but a NOW investigation found that sexual assault and rape is widespread. One study of National Guard and Reserve forces found that almost one in four women had been assaulted or raped. Last year alone, almost 3,000 soldiers reported sexual assault and rape by other soldiers. The shocking phenomenon has a label: military sexual trauma, or MST.

Friday night - check local listings

http://www.pbs.org/now/index.html

95.
Sitka

Bush-lite is no solution.
========================

Your ass is Bush-lite, Sitka, not a political solution.

I think the bill that Hill and Obama signed at the last minute was an appropriation bill with a time line added. Dodd's ammendment is a start to pull out now and a no funding if the pullout doesn't proceed. with pullout and funding to end in April 08.
It looks like the best out there, and like Floridagal says, if Dodd comes up in the polls because of it, the others will copy-cat/

From Moveon:

Polls show that a majority of voters everywhere support an exit from Iraq. That means that there isn't a single Democratic member of Congress whose constituents don't want to bring our troops home. Representatives who vote with President Bush on Iraq are voting against their districts.

Any notion that we can devise or impose some form of "political Solution" is delusionary.

A bit of good news.

Word from Cincinnati just now that Coultergeist speaking at Xavier received 20K for her speaking engagement tonight. BUT, the protesters on Coultergiest gathered 26 K as a counter to Coulter in contributions to a fund a counter Coulter's regressive hate speech.

99. More potty-mouth. tsk tsk

101.

Huron John
Thu, 09/06/07
8:05 pm
===============

Read the fine print John. People want a change of direction in Iraq and an end to the "war" (occupation) They also don't want a civil war to morph into a regional war. It is not an either or situation, except for the narrow-minded.

Your ass is Bush-lite, Sitka, not a political solution.

Another rejoinder for the ages from the maestro. 

Does FRED not make any sense just to me?

People want a change of direction in Iraq and an end to the "war" (occupation)

So let's leave 30,000 troops there for al Qaeda's target practice as Biden wants? 

103.
Huron John
99. More potty-mouth. tsk tsk

=================
Every thing Sitka says is potty-mouth bullshit.

see what I mean? Nothing but shit

see what I mean? Nothing but shit

FRED posted that Biden will leave 30K troops in Iraq, and I accept him as the blog authority on all things Biden. 

Every thing Sitka says is potty-mouth bullshit.

That everything I say is BS is FRED's opinion, and he's entitled to it. But I ask that FRED prove his other assertion. 

Shiite happens.

I need to go to sleep soon, but first there are two phrases we should dissect because they don't mean what we are supposed to think.

The first is political solution.  We're supposed to think that refers to the resolution of internal conflicts amongst Iraqis.  That's only half right.  What it really refers to is all Iraqis agreeing to let us stay there on the bases and persuading the insurgents not to attack them.  In other words, it's all about US.

The second is Iraqi security.  What does that mean?  Who exactly is supposed to be tied down or locked up or otherwise pacified?  Why, the Iraqi people, of course.  If the usual term were used, they'd be talking about a police state.  Since when does a Democracy require an army to keep the peace internally?  What we are supposed to believe is that the country is being invaded by some force other than us and needs to be protected by us.  That's a lie.

One more thing.  ABC reported tonight that the Americans have now taken 800 boys under 16 into detention.  They allege that these children are planters of IEDs and killers of Americans.  More likely, they're hostages to make their parents "behave." 

Katie Couric is a Bush supporter. Bashar al-Assad was very articulate in responding to her bully fascist innuendoes.

112.

Monica Smith
Thu, 09/06/07
8:42 pm
===============

A political solution is getting the people of Iraq what they - not what Bush installed - holding the country together with an iron hand. Bush cannot bring a political solution, because he doesn't see a need for one. To him it is just a military challenge.

We can leave with a political solution or we can leave without one. It would be better if we leave with one in place, regardless of when we leave.

The system in place, that Bush put together is doomed to failure. It is not what the Iraqi people want.

One more thing.  ABC reported tonight that the Americans have now taken 800 boys under 16 into detention.  They allege that these children are planters of IEDs and killers of Americans.  More likely, they're hostages to make their parents "behave."

Hussein may be dead, but his justice lives on under Bush. 

We can leave with a political solution or we can leave without one.

The US will never impose a political solution on Iraqis. 

But with Democratic leaders cowering in their foxholes, it looks increasingly like neither will happen for many years. 

116.

Sitka
Thu, 09/06/07
8:56 pm

The US will never impose a political solution on Iraqis.

====================
You just don't get it, do you? - That's what Bush did. He IMPOSED a political system after the invasion - that's what they are stuck with now - asshole! That's what is tearing the country apart with civil war.

Mark Fiore and it's a dandy.

http://www.markfiore.com/ 

This snooping thing is what we used to talk about re the dictatorships in South American countries. I wonder how long this judge will have his job.

Judge Strikes Down Parts of Patriot Act
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/090607R.shtml
CBS News and The Associated Press report that "a federal judge struck down parts of the revised USA Patriot Act as unconstitutional Thursday, saying courts must be allowed to supervise cases where the government orders Internet providers to turn over records without telling customers."

Well, this certainly explains a lot.

Special Report: Democratic House Officials Recruited Wealthy Conservatives
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/090607J.shtml
Matt Renner writes for Truthout, "According to Democratic candidates who ran for House of Representative seats in 2006, Rahm Emanuel, then head of the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee, took sides during the Democratic primary elections, favoring conservative candidates, including former Republicans, and sidelining candidates who were running in favor of withdrawal from Iraq."

So, how was the wading, Seashell?  Did you find a pool or what?

chiming in...

what the iraqui's really need is a social contract. the old one said do as you're told...or be imprisoned, tortured or die.

currently there isn't one, it appears. one of the cable pundits today mentioned the economic situation there with out going on to fully explore that statement.

returning to maslow:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maslow's_hierarchy_of_needs

the current state of existence for the individual iraqui is stuck on level 2. get it??? no one's going forward until the current state of affairs begins to settle into some means of normalcy.

i believe the key is to get the more aggressive factors out into the open so that they can play out. to do this, WE need to leave so that it isn't US that is the focus of the problem. simple to my mind.

the children who've been arrested: with the adult male population dwindling, i can believe that the next in line--in age--steps up to do what they think their elders would have done. this also seems fairly simple to me.

the problem with all of this was pointed out by olberman's broadcast tonight: it appears that "being" in iraq is the point and all else is facade. where do you go from there???

\

The enemy.

as long as he's the "enemy" he remains powerful. i'd rather have him be an international criminal.

Seashell keep on wadin' - hope u feel better soon
======
Fred/Sitka go to your rooms
======
Heard on Lou Dobbs Bush said something to Aussie assistant PM in response to a query about Iraq "We're kicking a**"
=====
Diary up on KOS about a guy flying today on Delta asked to remove his Impeach Bush/Cheney button and he refused -- they let him fly anyway but the flight attendant was complaining about political speech in the air or something stupid. Made me want to order a button of my own.
=====
Watch CSPAN Fridays at 8 for specials on presidential histories/libraries-tomorrow is Hoover - 2 hours live w/ call in
=====
Watch QVC Saturday at 6 and 9 for Manilow and on Colbert Tuesday 18th

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Maslow%27s_hierarchy_of_needs.svg

Nuclear warheads mistakenly flown on B-52, landing at Barksdale AFB

A B-52 bomber mistakenly loaded with five nuclear warheads flew from Minot Air Force Base, N.D, to Barksdale Air Force Base, La., on Aug. 30, resulting in an Air Force-wide investigation, according to three officers who asked not to be identified because they were not authorized to discuss the incident.

The B-52 was loaded with Advanced Cruise Missiles, part of a Defense Department effort to decommission 400 of the ACMs. But the nuclear warheads should have been removed at Minot before being transported to Barksdale, the officers said. The missiles were mounted onto the pylons of the bomber’s wings.

Belay my "The enemy" @ 123

and insert mprov's  "an international criminal"

Works for me. 

Does anyone understand Anbar province? Seems violence subsided there because the sheiks went after Al Queda. But a bunch of sheiks lost their lives in the event? And maybe this happened bc we retreated from Anbar and they were on their own? So maybe we should just get out of the country? All the question marks are bc I'm going on what I hear on TV and not sure I got the facts straight - would be happy to be enlightened.

Nuclear warheads mistakenly flown on B-52

>

And the s^it hit the fan.  All halt.  The brass is on top of it, Dan.

129. that's the way i've heard the story told. problem is there's private militias being set up, and armed by us, to do this work. where does that lead: example: afganistan?

Annilow

>

think mprov's got it w/Maslow at stage two - safety.

129. used to be an everyday occurance. and, paine's right, people are and will be punished. the commanding officer's career's over and also all those other officers who took part in the blunder. the enlisteds, if any, will likely be reprimanded.

sorry, stuck head...133 was a follow-on to paine's 130.

131,132 if there at Stage 2 that would be pretty good. Seems to me the sheiks could do just fine (or as fine as we're doing) if we just got the h*ll out and let them do it. I am sorry for the ones who died.

The mistake was so serious that President Bush and Defense Secretary Robert Gates were quickly informed, and Gates has asked for daily briefings on the Air Force investigation that was ordered, said Defense Department press secretary Geoff Morrell.

He said Gates was assured that "at no time was the public in danger."

[...] 

The Air Combat Command has ordered a commandwide stand down Sept. 14 to review procedures, officials said

[...]

In addition to the munitions squadron commander who was relieved of his duties, crews involved with the mistaken load — including ground-crew workers — have been temporarily decertified for handling munitions, one official said.

who can fault "the people" taking up the law and order question if the government fails to do so???

Hey, sea, Paine, Annilow, mprov! Good to *see* you. mprov: Maslow's needs hierarchy is always apt.

And yes, we should get the H*ll out and the sooner the better.

By the way, Riverbend is back. See her latest at http://riverbendblog.blogspot.com/

The good news is that she is safely out of Iraq.

The bad news is that the US proxy, Israel, is bombing Syria.

And so it goes.

i used to be a "special" weapons load leader. decertification is career death...

hey judy. is the south fun?

RIP Luciano! The world is truly poorer without you.

===============
Italy mourns tenor with voice of platinum
Singer succumbed to cancer of pancreas which he saw as payment for happiness
John Hooper in Rome
Friday September 7, 2007
Guardian

Mourners last night began to file past the coffin of Luciano Pavarotti in Modena cathedral at the end of a day of searing bereavement in which the heart of Italy went out to a man its prime minister, Romano Prodi, said had devoted his life to "spreading passion and culture".

The great tenor's funeral service, to be held in the cathedral tomorrow, is expected to be attended by a host of celebrities from the world of music and beyond. Mr Prodi is expected to postpone an official visit to Slovenia in order to attend.

Pavarotti's manager, Terri Robson, said the singer died at 5am at his country house. At his side were his second wife, Nicoletta Mantovani, their young daughter, Alice, and his three daughters by his first marriage, Lorenza, Cristina and Giuliana. Pavarotti's sister, his nephews and other relatives and friends were also present. But not apparently Adua Veroni, to whom he was married for 34 years before he wed his assistant. "Big Luciano", as the 127kg (20st) singer was known, succumbed to cancer of the pancreas diagnosed in July last year. In his last interview, with the Italian daily Corriere della Sera, he said he regarded it as a kind of payment for his "fortune and happiness".

Mr Robson said: "In fitting with the approach that characterised his life and work, he remained positive until succumbing to the last stages of his illness."

The singer was taken to hospital last month and spent two and a half weeks undergoing tests and treatment before returning home on August 25. His doctor, Antonio Frassoldati, told Sky Italia that Pavarotti was "aware of what was happening" to the end.

[...]
http://www.guardian.co.uk/print/0,,33069...

Judy

Happy 50th ! 

The pools nearest my house are closed for renovation until the 15th.  Neither and phone book nor net list public swimming pools except for these two.  Strange.  I'm trying to figure out if I can walk in the bathtub.  Or maybe a wading pool...  I'm near a river but the bottom is soft sinking and muddy. 

Off to do some more pool research.

No more blood money but they're not listening.  They really think that they can win the WH by being cowards and that we'll come around.  Not this time.

Third party or Al Gore. 

I think the republican Party must be held responsible for

propping up the Bush Administration fro the past 7 years.

It has been like a grotesque composition by Salvador Dali.

The South is great fun, mprov. I am only sorry that it's taken me this long to get to see it. Any of you who do get the chance, do go!

There are lots of nice people and lots of different cultures here. What fun to see them living and working together!

Obviously, we are only getting to scratch a tiny bit of the surface. Today we drove along the southern part of the Natchez Trace, then turned into Vicksburg, where we are resting our weary heads tonight. We spent the afternoon on a tour of the National Battlefield, where lots of lives were lost on both sides. Just seeing the states represented and their positions, illustrated graphically with plaques (red for the Confederacy and blue for the Union), really brought home how destructive the *Civil War* was and how we are still suffering from its consequences today. Just as we have seen in Iraq over these past years, a little enlightenment and common sense would likely have worked wonders, but there was too much profit to be made from Reconstruction.

What I never realized was how dependent the Battle of Vicksburg was on the Union's *Inland Navy* ... ironclad riverboats mounted with about 13 cannons ... and how resourceful the underindustrialized agricultural Southerners were at improvising "torpedos," which were generally their only defense against them. They actually managed to sink one of these, the Cairo (pronounced "kay-row"). It was lifted out of its bed of mud and silt in 1964 and now serves as a cornerstone, with its own separate museum at the park. Visitors can walk through, in and around it. A fair number of the crew were not even US citizens, but were from seafaring European nations. Others were from the West and Midwest because all from those areas realized the strategic importance of the Mississippi.

Before coming to Vicksburg, however, we stopped off to see the Natchez Great Nation mounds in Natchez, where Native American cultures flourished from about 7000 BC to the 18th century.

There is certainly a rich heritage here. And that is truly an understatement.

142. LOL Paine, it's not OUR 50th ... we're at 26 and holding!

It was a couple whom we have known for a LONG time and whose truly lovely children organized a fantastic celebration in their honor.

The Dali analogy is quite apt, Paine, IMHO!

Speaking of the south...

I was in the Virginia area lest week, and while in Baltimore we found it remarkably odd that very few people of color/blacks were anywhere near the inner harbor.

Same goes for Richmond and ...virtually everywhere.  Segregation is the culture. 

Let me tell you, folks...it ain'a like that in the northeast.  We are pretty much assimilated, if that's the way to describe it.

JudyforDean

>

too funny ;)  well, happy happy anyway!  Enjoy your travels.  Sounds like you are.

whoever should do this with W's mug

Party on all -- my pumpkin awaits. Hi Judy.

One of my nephews is currently in Afghanistan. All my sympathies go to the families of these young men.

So where are all the children and family members of the warmongers?

=====================
British soldiers killed on patrol are named
· Victims of Afghanistan attack aged 18 and 23
· Interpreter died after airlift to medical centre
Owen Bowcott
Friday September 7, 2000
Guardian

Two young soldiers killed when their Land Rover was caught in a roadside explosion in Afghanistan were named by the Ministry of Defence last night.

Privates Ben Ford and Damian Wright were the first members of the newly-formed 2nd Battalion The Mercian Regiment (Worcesters and Foresters), to be killed on operations. One was 18, the other 23, married, and with a young son.

Their identities were revealed a day after the attack on their patrol which was travelling north of Lashkar Gah in Helmand, southern Afghanistan.

Both soldiers died at the scene when their Land Rover received the impact of the blast. A third British soldier and an interpreter were injured and airlifted to an International Security Assistance Force medical centre at Camp Bastion for treatment. The interpreter later died.

Pte Ford, 18, from Chesterfield, had been with the army for two years. Afghanistan was his first overseas posting. In a statement released through the army, his family said: "We are immensely proud of our son and know that he lost his life doing something he was proud to be a part of and that he loved."

Officers and friends in the regiment paid tribute to his enthusiasm and cheerfulness. The officer commanding his company, Major Paul Gilby, said: "With his pale skin and fair hair he always battled to avoid sunburn in the scorching heat of Afghanistan but would generally end up looking like a lollipop."

[...]
http://www.guardian.co.uk/print/0,,33069...

Because of my job, I have had to spend a great deal of time in the car over the past few weeks.  Over that time I have listened to a lot of talk radio (it's comic relief; plus it really motivates me) it's Limbaugh from noon to three; Hannity from three to six and some guy names Mark Levin from six until I get back in the office.

I've noticed something really interesting in listening... invariably Limbaugh will have three major topics for the day (attacking whoever) and he'll hammer on certain talking points on those topics. Then Hannity will come on and have exactly the same three topics and talking points, in exactly the same order. He'll use a little different wording, but the same talking points. Then Levin will come on (this guys a trip; crazier than Liddy) and he'll have the same three talking points as Limbaugh and Hannity. After one day I thought it was a coincidence; but it happens at least 4 days a week; usually every day. Obviously they are all totally orchestrated. I wonder where they get their talking points from. I would assume either the White House or RNC.

Geez, Paine ... when were you last at the Inner Harbour in Balmer? I have always seen it as multicolored ... and not just with blacks and whites.

No, it's not perfect, but then, neither is the Northeast from what I have observed.

I wasn't the only one who found what I reported - remarkable, Judy.  I don't know?

NEW THREAD waiting for a first.

john nelson

>

Thanks for taking the time.  It's appreciated by all.

You just don't get it, do you? - That's what Bush did. He IMPOSED a political system after the invasion - that's what they are stuck with now - asshole! That's what is tearing the country apart with civil war.

Hmmmm.... then why is Biden, and his lovable mouthpiece FRED, proposing a slightly different version of the same thing? 

I'll take advice from many people, but not someone who said Grapski deserved to be assaulted by corrupt police.